Does the Church Do A Good Job?

[kitty]

Hello Saints,
This is the question that I would like to pose to all of you today. "Does the Church do enough to prepare singles for marriage?"

The reason that I am asking this question is because I myself am in a season in which I am really truly preparing to be married mentally, physically and spiritually.

I have connected with a prayer partner and we have decided to study certain Christian books that focus on preparation for marriage. Two of the books that we are currently studying are "God is a MatchMaker" by Derek Prince and "Lady in Waiting".

Both of the books seem to offer a wealth of information that I don't seem to be receiving at church. In fact it darned on me that to be perfectly honest I haven't received that much instruction from church except for the following things... Don't have sex outside of marriage, seek God and wise counsel, prepare to be submissive, and... if you really, really want to be married.... Then go busy yourself doing work for the Lord and then your husband will find you like Ruth in the field....

Now I think all of those may be valid things but then I have a person like Giants who is always making really good suggestions such as... Pray to God about what kind of man you will be married to... Ask God what ways you will be required to minister to your husband? Ask God what are His views on marriage? Ask God what qualities you need to develop....

So I thought to myself... How come I never get those kind of ideas from any church I have attended?

So I thought hhhmmm.... maybe this is one of the ways that the Church is lacking. Maybe this is one of the reasons that divorce among Christians is just as high as it is among the world? Because we aren't truly preparing people for marriage in the first place.

What are your thoughts on this guys? Do you think the church does enough to prepare singles for marriage? For those of you that are married do you think the church did enough to prepare you? Does anyone attend a church that has classes to prepare for marriage... That is open to everyhone not just those who are already engaged... Because that that point... the person may not have a lot of time to prepare anyway...

Come on and Share...


Kitty

[chosen]

Another good book that Im reading its called Single, Saved, and Having Sex by Ty Adams its really awesome. It talkes about sexual purity and stuff like that.

[giantsdodie]

First off the term " the church " is far too generic. There are some churches that to a great job and there are some churches that do a terrible job. Sometimes we have an image of the church being a unified organizational body... yet the reality is that it is not.

Secondly while we would like the church to teach us all the suttle little nuances in our lives. the reality is that depending on the church and its mission it might not be able to do so. How much teaching on marriage did Jesus Himself do?

I didnt learn most of what I learned about marriage in the church,. I learned most of what I learned from spending time with the Lord. I asked God to teach me about marriage. I told the Lord your word says husbands love your wives as Christ loved the church.. I said I dont know what that means..

He said study my Son.. which I did .. I studied Jesus relationship with the church. Then I studied what the Word already says about husbands and wives. Then I studied God's relationship with Israel. Then I realized while studying that that marriage is a covenant. Then I studied covenants.

it was God who revealed His will to me regarding marriage. It was God who revealed to me certain details about marriage and in particular MY marriage to MY wife.

IMO the church should teach people how to seek God for themselves and how to hear GOD. The church should not prepare singles for marriage because that in itself will create more problems. Most people dont even handle their singleness well. What about those singles who will never be married?

Teach people about covenant. Teach them how to be married to JESUS. Teach them how to find their identity is Chirst. Teach them to seek God about who HE is.. Who is He to them. Who is He IN them, Who are they to Him. Who are they IN Him..

This is far more important to a single believer than how to get prepared for marriage. Thats why you have so many issues right now.. You have two halves of people coming together to make a whole person.. the reality is that marriage is not addition.. Its multiplication...

This is marriage

1x1=1 ( and the two shall become ONE flesh ) One in purpose, one in unity, One as Jesus and the Father are one...

Unfortunately many marriage are like this.

1x0=0 anything times zero is zero

0x0=0

.5X.5=.25 when you multiply half and a half you get a quarter.. in other words 50% times 50% equals 25%.... you get LESS than what you came in with.

1x.5= .5 you have a whole person and a half a person.. you get a half..

You need two WHOLE people...

I believe the focus for singles should be.. being WHOLE ( which is one of the meanings of the word Single... ).. Notice that the Word of God doesnt really have teaching on how to teach singles to prepare for marri

That way you are WHOLE.. nothing missing.. nothing broken... You are whole whether you are married or not...

The problem as I see it is that marriage is far too much ME focused. It focused on someone being with ME.. someone to make ME feel good.. someone to embrace ME... someone to acknowledge ME...

When the REALITY is that marriage is a ministry.. and the word minister means to SERVE...

Which is why I believe the Word alreayd has the guidelines.. focus on the Lord.. focus on learning to serve HIM.. serve your Lord.. Serve your church.. serve your community...

And as you serve the Lord abd build your relationship with HIM, then HE qualifies you for marriage..

I think a lot of times we are looking for a course that once we complete it..

TA DAAAAAAAAAAAA DUN DUN DUN DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I AM NOW QUALIFIED AN READY TO BE MARRIED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But we arent married to Jesus.. We arent His bride.. We arent faithful to HIM in the way HE desires faithfulness... We arent ddicated to HIM.

and therefore we are not qualified..

These are things that are learned in our personal one on one relationship with the Lord...

The church can provide guidelines... yet We have to press in...

[kitty]

Hey giants,
I agree with a lot of points that you made. I think the fact that Jesus himself didn't do a lot of teaching on marriage is a good point. Yet I do still feel that in general "most" churches, not all should be teaching or offeing a little for instruction than they do on being prepared to have a stable Christian marriage.

Yes I also agree that there is an important fact that we should focus on being the bride to Jesus. In fact on of the books that I am reading does point that out. Yet to be perfectly honest Giants I rarely run across sermons that focus on that fact. So wouldn't it be alright to have a class that teaches this as well?

What is the opinion of you other guys? Come on and Share...


Jessica.. you know I heard the title of that book before but I never had the chance to read it. I didn't know it was really about sexual purity. Since the title was called saved, single and having sex... I assumed that it was discussing the fact that thre are many sinlge Christians that are still having sex outside of marriage... In fact I just ran across a "worldly" non-believer the other day who let me know that in his opinion Christian woman were not better than those in the world. Most of the ones he knew were willing to engage him and in a relationship and that included sex as well.

Ok to the rest of you guys... stop just peaking in... Come on and post!


Kitty

[chosen]

I understand kitty I thought that too, but you will understand the title after you start reading the Book. Ty gives her own testimony how she has overcome. It is a really awesome book. I know the title does throw you though I wish she could of came up with a better name for her book.

Love
Jessica

[chosen]

giantsdodie said:

First off the term " the church " is far too generic. There are some churches that to a great job and there are some churches that do a terrible job. Sometimes we have an image of the church being a unified organizational body... yet the reality is that it is not.

Secondly while we would like the church to teach us all the suttle little nuances in our lives. the reality is that depending on the church and its mission it might not be able to do so. How much teaching on marriage did Jesus Himself do?


I didnt learn most of what I learned about marriage in the church,. I learned most of what I learned from spending time with the Lord. I asked God to teach me about marriage. I told the Lord your word says husbands love your wives as Christ loved the church.. I said I dont know what that means..

He said study my Son.. which I did .. I studied Jesus relationship with the church. Then I studied what the Word already says about husbands and wives. Then I studied God's relationship with Israel. Then I realized while studying that that marriage is a covenant. Then I studied covenants.

it was God who revealed His will to me regarding marriage. It was God who revealed to me certain details about marriage and in particular MY marriage to MY wife.

IMO the church should teach people how to seek God for themselves and how to hear GOD. The church should not prepare singles for marriage because that in itself will create more problems. Most people dont even handle their singleness well. What about those singles who will never be married?

Teach people about covenant. Teach them how to be married to JESUS. Teach them how to find their identity is Chirst. Teach them to seek God about who HE is.. Who is He to them. Who is He IN them, Who are they to Him. Who are they IN Him..

This is far more important to a single believer than how to get prepared for marriage. Thats why you have so many issues right now.. You have two halves of people coming together to make a whole person.. the reality is that marriage is not addition.. Its multiplication...

This is marriage

1x1=1 ( and the two shall become ONE flesh ) One in purpose, one in unity, One as Jesus and the Father are one...

Unfortunately many marriage are like this.

1x0=0 anything times zero is zero

0x0=0

.5X.5=.25 when you multiply half and a half you get a quarter.. in other words 50% times 50% equals 25%.... you get LESS than what you came in with.

1x.5= .5 you have a whole person and a half a person.. you get a half..

You need two WHOLE people...

I believe the focus for singles should be.. being WHOLE ( which is one of the meanings of the word Single... ).. Notice that the Word of God doesnt really have teaching on how to teach singles to prepare for marri

That way you are WHOLE.. nothing missing.. nothing broken... You are whole whether you are married or not...

The problem as I see it is that marriage is far too much ME focused. It focused on someone being with ME.. someone to make ME feel good.. someone to embrace ME... someone to acknowledge ME...

When the REALITY is that marriage is a ministry.. and the word minister means to SERVE...

Which is why I believe the Word alreayd has the guidelines.. focus on the Lord.. focus on learning to serve HIM.. serve your Lord.. Serve your church.. serve your community...

And as you serve the Lord abd build your relationship with HIM, then HE qualifies you for marriage..

I think a lot of times we are looking for a course that once we complete it..

TA DAAAAAAAAAAAA DUN DUN DUN DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I AM NOW QUALIFIED AN READY TO BE MARRIED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But we arent married to Jesus.. We arent His bride.. We arent faithful to HIM in the way HE desires faithfulness... We arent ddicated to HIM.

and therefore we are not qualified..

These are things that are learned in our personal one on one relationship with the Lord...

The church can provide guidelines... yet We have to press in...

Amina Giant! I wish there was more teachings in the Church on how to be Whole, and to live in Victory according the Word of God........So how do we begin to walk in Completeness in God. In the state that I am at right know I really don't know where to begin to pick up the pieces of my life.........

Many Blessings
Jessica

[stillfocused]

Amen..Giants !! I agree that when you spend more time focused on being one with Christ as his Bride..you will find that you are being prepared for marriage. For many unmarried single) believers the focus is on finding someone to be with. I sharing with people last week how even though I am unmarried..I am complete and single that meant being whole..we're not incomplete because we don't have a ring on our ring fingers yet, Praise God !! When you're busy doing what God wants you to do..that time will come..when you least expect it. But, in the mean time become one with Christ. Other good reading material is the Song of Songs, Knight in Shining Armour..by PB Wilson. She challenges you to take 6 mths and work on you...excellent book it's a must have your book collection.

[stillfocused]

As for the church doing a good job..some churches do a very good job..yet, other churches do a poor job because their focus and vision is not towards singles. There are alot of misconceptions regarding those who not married..Myles Munroe did excellent teaching on this subject last year at a Singles Conference. It was liberating because he let it be known how to accept that place in your life yet, to continue to prepare for the season when you will marry.

[giantsdodie]

I feel a very blunt moment coming on....

Ok I am going to try and be polite and blunt about this ( that in itself is a challenge )

There is a LOT of this kind of teaching going on and has been going on for a long time.

Ive seen people that brought Woman Thout Art Loosed.... Went to the conference.. Got the Video and the workbook.. Got the CD...

And they STILL aint loosed yet... You know why.. hearing a message or a teaching over and over and over doesnt do a darn thing...

APPLICATION is the problem...

While I dont share much about my church allow me to share this..

I am one of the deacons in our church and I am considered one of the leaders ( we have the presiding elders.. Pastor, Asst Pastor and Prophet.. and then three deacons.. )

God has blessed and enabled me to minister the Word of God in our church pretty consistently the last year ( every other 4th Sunday )

There was a period where GOD taught on the topic of Faith for OVER A YEAR.. through five different ministers.. All teaching Faith in God in different ways.. different styles.. etc etc...

And while many people have grown in faith in different ways we have some people sitting in the pews who have been with the ministry from day one who are some of the most faithless people I have ever seen in my entire life..

As Sister Beulah said the problem with us is that we dont develop a relationship with God..

This is the truth.. We have relationships with ministries.. and pastors.. and organizations.. yet we dont have that intimate relationship with GOD that causes is to grow...

And because WE dont take the time..

We dont study the Word.. and I mean STUDY.. not read along with the Pastor on Sunday...

We dont pray.. and I dont mean pray when stuff is wrong.. We dont spend the time in prayer to cultivate a relationship.. and we dont stay long enough to HEAR anything.. we just drop off our laundry list and expect GOD to clean it up...

We DONT fast.. oh GOD NO !!! Consecration ?!!!!!!! No way.. Maybe if the church calls one and we will probably cheat al the way through it...

SO because dont spend the time to get what we need directly from the Lord, we tend to shift the blame to " the church " when we dont get or receive the things we think we should get...

Does that mean the church is not responsible to teach.. NO absolutely not...

However the ONUS of your growth and maturity in Christ is on YOU..

[livinganewlife]

As always thanks Bro GDD for breaking that multiplication and algebra down........................ that was awesome......

I would like to add that while many are seeking for answers in regards to marriage that too many time the words we (general) hear are erroneous man made teachings.....backed up with a scripture or two (out of context)....

Because through all my singleness not once can I recall relationship building with God as a number one priority....

The main thing that many singles are taught in church, especially women is to get yourself together...... get your credit straight, teeth fixed, lose some weight, join a book club, keep yourself busy etc.....

Rarely was there a Single Session and someone mentioned developing a real relationship with the Lord......

Bro GDD thank you and may God Bless you even as I sit here today your post with the multiplication has really blessed me in so many ways....

[chosen]

giantsdodie said:

I feel a very blunt moment coming on....

Ok I am going to try and be polite and blunt about this ( that in itself is a challenge )

There is a LOT of this kind of teaching going on and has been going on for a long time.

Ive seen people that brought Woman Thout Art Loosed.... Went to the conference.. Got the Video and the workbook.. Got the CD...

And they STILL aint loosed yet... You know why.. hearing a message or a teaching over and over and over doesnt do a darn thing...

APPLICATION is the problem...

While I dont share much about my church allow me to share this..

I am one of the deacons in our church and I am considered one of the leaders ( we have the presiding elders.. Pastor, Asst Pastor and Prophet.. and then three deacons.. )

God has blessed and enabled me to minister the Word of God in our church pretty consistently the last year ( every other 4th Sunday )

There was a period where GOD taught on the topic of Faith for OVER A YEAR.. through five different ministers.. All teaching Faith in God in different ways.. different styles.. etc etc...

And while many people have grown in faith in different ways we have some people sitting in the pews who have been with the ministry from day one who are some of the most faithless people I have ever seen in my entire life..

As Sister Beulah said the problem with us is that we dont develop a relationship with God..

This is the truth.. We have relationships with ministries.. and pastors.. and organizations.. yet we dont have that intimate relationship with GOD that causes is to grow...

And because WE dont take the time..

We dont study the Word.. and I mean STUDY.. not read along with the Pastor on Sunday...

We dont pray.. and I dont mean pray when stuff is wrong.. We dont spend the time in prayer to cultivate a relationship.. and we dont stay long enough to HEAR anything.. we just drop off our laundry list and expect GOD to clean it up...

We DONT fast.. oh GOD NO !!! Consecration ?!!!!!!! No way.. Maybe if the church calls one and we will probably cheat al the way through it...

SO because dont spend the time to get what we need directly from the Lord, we tend to shift the blame to " the church " when we dont get or receive the things we think we should get...

Does that mean the church is not responsible to teach.. NO absolutely not...

However the ONUS of your growth and maturity in Christ is on YOU..

All I can say Is WOW!

[chosen]

Another Good Book One of the Mothers told me about its called " He's FINE, But is He saved"
Im gonna have to check it out.

[Nikkol]

I think that GDD did a great job indicating the answer to the question.... Other than that, pre-marital counselling helps deal with a lot of different things; some of which the couple may not have thought about.

Re: High divorce rate
I think that when people make their vows, many times they either don't understand or think that their marriage will be "perfect". Every marriage has issues, sometimes we may not like each other for a while or even just be upset with each other. The difference is that if we believe as we stated that marriage is for life and although things aren't good at the moment, that falls under the "For worse" and that all in all everything falls under "till death do us part" one may fight a little more.

[And Such Were Some Of You]

Excellent posts, GDD!

I agree and I also believe that we look for the church to do too much for us. We are responsible for knowing the Word of God and by spending time with the Word and in prayer, I believe that the Holy Spirit will teach us all we should know. Therefore, He will also guide us to whatever book etc. if that we should purchase - if any at all.

We cannot blame the church for its lack of teaching on things that may not be for them to do. As GDD also pointed out, some churches are teaching in this area - and are doing a really good job. Personally, I would rather God tell me how I am to prepare for my husband.

[Beulah5]

Do we really believe that when the lord said i will send u another teacher that He meant it? Do we really know Him to the point where we sit down and are instructed by Him the same way u would if u were in a classroom listening to a teacher?

That is how close we can be with the lord.
Where we hear His voice re every single thing including marriage, when and where.
I know a woman whom the lord told her the name of her husband down to the fact the day He would be proposing to her and what His vision was for their life for the next 30 years and it happened exactly to the day. That has happened and is happening to those who BELIEVE that such a realm of walking with the lord exists.

Then again u are talking to someone who believes it is time many believers gave up their libraries and conferences and simply returned to the word of God cause the amount of books that i have read did not do a single thing for me untill i decided i really wanted to know God for myself, told my cush job to take a hike, took up midnight potwashing few days a week in a hotel and sold stuff on ebay so i could simply seek the lord for hours a day untill i knew that I had captured me and He me.

Till it was no longer sometimes i hear Him and sometimes i am not so sure. I would rise early and go for long coastal walks seeking the lords detailed plan for my life not just the one i simply sensed He had for me or the one i had been prophesied but everything that was on His mind for my life since the day i was born till right now.

I did that untill one day i woke up and an angel was standing in my room. Needless to say that was not enough i said i wanna see you Jesus and i wanna know u. So He came. He taught me how to worship Him untill i fell into a doorway in the Spirit called servant hood there the lord will come and speak to me about Himself, my purpose, the ministry He had for me down to details.

He took me up into heaven and taught me how to drink from the river of life, because i could not afford it He Himself carried me spiritually into major conferences in the world that He wanted me to participate in learning from. -the Holy Spirit would literally walk into my room just like u and i walk into a place and i would hear and physically experience Him.

I sat at His feet and learned how to intercede for nations, how to break spirits that were running mok in my family, how to walk in the way of love- and the ifs, whys and whens of my life. I learned to go into that presence every day and learn what exactly His plan was for my life every single day down to who He wanted me to evangelize to and i am still in pursuit of more.

The thousands i spent in trying to know Him. I am not trying to knock anybody and certainly not u my sister kitty i am simply saying that i am learning that there is a better way.
Sitting at the feet of Jesus till we get a word is far more cost effective and time saving than a 1000 messages and books and teachings.

We are His blood bought His desire is that we will always know what is on His mind for us. He died that each and everyone of us will have that relationship that Moses had and more with the father where the cloud of glory will come down and give Him detailed instructions as to the how, whens and hows. It is not for a select few prophets it is for all of us.

In His presence He will tell u why the journey has been so long, why this and dat happened, what was a mistake and what was Him pressing you out or what was the devil. He will tell u of things to come down to the blue print of ur life not only that but He will show us stuff about others who are suffering and in need of direction, of encouragement and u will always have a word in due season to not just walk perfectly b4 Him but to also share with the woman on the job whom u have tried to reach for years. Jesus will tell u something about her that only God could possibly know and in so doing lead her to the lord in a matter of minutes than 10 years of 'trying to reach her' hasnt accomplished.

It is all found in sitting at the feet of the Master. Whatever it costs do it, however u need to do so do it because without it life and even christianity can become a kind of lucky strike. Jesus will tell u if it is His will for u to marry, when He will bring ur man or if to hold on and not only that He will give u the grace and give u of Himself so that u are perpetually satisfied in the inner man.

He is good like dat He really is. 5 mins in the anointing accomplishes more than an entire lifestyle.

Encouragement over ladies:)