Post by krazeeboi on Jun 11, 2009 11:33:52 GMT -5
Drake, former SBC officer, says he's praying for Obama to die (updated)
By Bob Allen
Wednesday, June 03, 2009
NEW YORK (ABP) -- A former Southern Baptist Convention officer who on June 2 called the death of abortion provider George Tiller an answer to prayer said later in the day he is also praying "imprecatory prayer" against President Obama.
Wiley Drake, pastor of First Southern Baptist Church in Buena Park, Calif., and former running mate of American Independent Party presidential candidate Alan Keyes, said June 2 on Fox News Radio he didn't understand why people were upset with his comments quoted by Associated Baptist Press from a webcast of his daily radio talk show.
"Imprecatory prayer is agreeing with God, and if people don't like that, they need to talk to God," Drake told syndicated talk-show host Alan Colmes. "God said it, I didn't. I was just agreeing with God."
Asked if there are others for whom Drake is praying "imprecatory prayer," Drake hesitated before answering that there are several. "The usurper that is in the White House is one, B. Hussein Obama," he said.
Later in the interview, Colmes returned to Drake's answer to make sure he heard him right.
"Are you praying for his death?" Colmes asked.
"Yes," Drake replied.
"So you're praying for the death of the president of the United States?"
"Yes."
Colmes asked Drake if he was concerned that by saying that he might be placed on a Secret Service or FBI watch list, and if he believed it appropriate to talk or pray that way.
"I think it's appropriate to pray the Word of God," Drake said. "I'm not saying anything. What I am doing is repeating what God is saying, and if that puts me on somebody's list, then I'll just have to be on their list."
"You would like for the president of the United States to die?" Colmes asked once more.
"If he does not turn to God and does not turn his life around, I am asking God to enforce imprecatory prayers that are throughout the Scripture that would cause him death, that's correct."
Most of the half-hour interview on "The Alan Colmes Show" is premium programming available by paid subscription, but a five-minute clip appeared as a "top video" on the Fox News Radio website.
Drake said he didn't pray for Tiller to be murdered -- only that God would take his life by some method -- but that he "absolutely" believed that God wanted the doctor dead.
"I believe the whole Bible, Alan," he explained. "I don't just preach part of it. I don't just preach the soft, fuzzy, warm stuff where we're supposed to be nice to everybody. I preach the whole Bible."
Part of the Bible, Drake claimed, is imprecatory prayer -- words of judgment in the Psalms prayed back to God -- a practice he said the church has lost.
Drake fielded calls from a few listeners, including one identifying himself as a lifelong Southern Baptist who said he was saddened to hear a minister would pray for someone to die.
"This whole concept that we're always to pray little, nice, soft, fluffy, prayers -- that we're not to pray imprecatory prayer -- has been something that just, in all honesty, that Southern Baptists have lost, and we need to regain imprecatory prayer," Drake said. "It is in the Bible, and we are proud to say as Southern Baptists that we believe the Book. You've got to believe the whole Book, brother, or you don't believe any of it."
Asked if he thinks there might be other people praying imprecatory prayers for him that might be successful, Drake said, "Well, that's certainly possible, but that's in God's hands, not in mine."
Asked if he claimed to know God's will, Drake replied: "In some cases I do. Not in all cases. I know this, that if I do die right now, I'll go to heaven when I die because I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. That's why I'll go to heaven and not to hell. And the reason George Tiller went to hell when he died was not because he killed babies, as terrible as that was. If he went to hell, and I think he did -- that's God's judgment and not mine -- but if he did go to hell it's because he did not accept Jesus Christ as his personal Lord and Savior."
Drake said he did not believe Tiller's accused killer is a pro-life Christian.
"I'm of the opinion -- and now everybody's going to say 'There goes Wiley down the conspiracy-theory road,' I'm of the opinion that somebody in the Obama camp had this guy killed."
"Who benefits the most from this man killing a doctor?" Drake asked. "We certainly don't. Pro-life people certainly don't. It hurts us. It damages us, but Obama will indeed advance it. This will be one of those crises to take advantage of, and he's already done that."
Drake said he had no evidence and admitted his opinion for now is "pure speculation."
"Everybody said [Lee Harvey] Oswald was a lone gunman, et cetera, et cetera, too," he said. "But I think we're going to find there was somebody else involved."
Drake said Tiller's murder would be a setback for pro-life Christians seeking to end abortion by legal and proper means. He said he also expects to see answers to other imprecatory prayers in the days ahead.
"God says very clearly in his Word that we are to continue to pray and he will answer our prayers," Drake said.
Sing Oldham, vice president for convention relations with the SBC Executive Committee, was unavailable for comment until late on May 4.
He said that while Drake served one year as second vice president of the SBC, he is not now nor has ever been a spokesman for the convention.
"Mr. Drake does not represent Southern Baptist actions, resolutions, or positions in his interpretation and application of 'imprecatory prayers,'" Oldham said. "Any comments made by Wiley Drake on this subject represent his personal views, not those of the Convention."
Oldham said most Baptists view the imprecatory prayers found in the Psalms as private, heartfelt conversations between oppressed people and God, and reflect confidence that God will eventually vindicate the innocent. He said they generally close with a conscious decision not to bear malice and leave final judgment up to God.
"I think it is fair to say that the vast majority of Southern Baptists reject any call to pray imprecatory prayers of death over any individual," he said.
-30-
Bob Allen is senior writer for Associated Baptist Press.
By Bob Allen
Wednesday, June 03, 2009
NEW YORK (ABP) -- A former Southern Baptist Convention officer who on June 2 called the death of abortion provider George Tiller an answer to prayer said later in the day he is also praying "imprecatory prayer" against President Obama.
Wiley Drake, pastor of First Southern Baptist Church in Buena Park, Calif., and former running mate of American Independent Party presidential candidate Alan Keyes, said June 2 on Fox News Radio he didn't understand why people were upset with his comments quoted by Associated Baptist Press from a webcast of his daily radio talk show.
"Imprecatory prayer is agreeing with God, and if people don't like that, they need to talk to God," Drake told syndicated talk-show host Alan Colmes. "God said it, I didn't. I was just agreeing with God."
Asked if there are others for whom Drake is praying "imprecatory prayer," Drake hesitated before answering that there are several. "The usurper that is in the White House is one, B. Hussein Obama," he said.
Later in the interview, Colmes returned to Drake's answer to make sure he heard him right.
"Are you praying for his death?" Colmes asked.
"Yes," Drake replied.
"So you're praying for the death of the president of the United States?"
"Yes."
Colmes asked Drake if he was concerned that by saying that he might be placed on a Secret Service or FBI watch list, and if he believed it appropriate to talk or pray that way.
"I think it's appropriate to pray the Word of God," Drake said. "I'm not saying anything. What I am doing is repeating what God is saying, and if that puts me on somebody's list, then I'll just have to be on their list."
"You would like for the president of the United States to die?" Colmes asked once more.
"If he does not turn to God and does not turn his life around, I am asking God to enforce imprecatory prayers that are throughout the Scripture that would cause him death, that's correct."
Most of the half-hour interview on "The Alan Colmes Show" is premium programming available by paid subscription, but a five-minute clip appeared as a "top video" on the Fox News Radio website.
Drake said he didn't pray for Tiller to be murdered -- only that God would take his life by some method -- but that he "absolutely" believed that God wanted the doctor dead.
"I believe the whole Bible, Alan," he explained. "I don't just preach part of it. I don't just preach the soft, fuzzy, warm stuff where we're supposed to be nice to everybody. I preach the whole Bible."
Part of the Bible, Drake claimed, is imprecatory prayer -- words of judgment in the Psalms prayed back to God -- a practice he said the church has lost.
Drake fielded calls from a few listeners, including one identifying himself as a lifelong Southern Baptist who said he was saddened to hear a minister would pray for someone to die.
"This whole concept that we're always to pray little, nice, soft, fluffy, prayers -- that we're not to pray imprecatory prayer -- has been something that just, in all honesty, that Southern Baptists have lost, and we need to regain imprecatory prayer," Drake said. "It is in the Bible, and we are proud to say as Southern Baptists that we believe the Book. You've got to believe the whole Book, brother, or you don't believe any of it."
Asked if he thinks there might be other people praying imprecatory prayers for him that might be successful, Drake said, "Well, that's certainly possible, but that's in God's hands, not in mine."
Asked if he claimed to know God's will, Drake replied: "In some cases I do. Not in all cases. I know this, that if I do die right now, I'll go to heaven when I die because I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. That's why I'll go to heaven and not to hell. And the reason George Tiller went to hell when he died was not because he killed babies, as terrible as that was. If he went to hell, and I think he did -- that's God's judgment and not mine -- but if he did go to hell it's because he did not accept Jesus Christ as his personal Lord and Savior."
Drake said he did not believe Tiller's accused killer is a pro-life Christian.
"I'm of the opinion -- and now everybody's going to say 'There goes Wiley down the conspiracy-theory road,' I'm of the opinion that somebody in the Obama camp had this guy killed."
"Who benefits the most from this man killing a doctor?" Drake asked. "We certainly don't. Pro-life people certainly don't. It hurts us. It damages us, but Obama will indeed advance it. This will be one of those crises to take advantage of, and he's already done that."
Drake said he had no evidence and admitted his opinion for now is "pure speculation."
"Everybody said [Lee Harvey] Oswald was a lone gunman, et cetera, et cetera, too," he said. "But I think we're going to find there was somebody else involved."
Drake said Tiller's murder would be a setback for pro-life Christians seeking to end abortion by legal and proper means. He said he also expects to see answers to other imprecatory prayers in the days ahead.
"God says very clearly in his Word that we are to continue to pray and he will answer our prayers," Drake said.
Sing Oldham, vice president for convention relations with the SBC Executive Committee, was unavailable for comment until late on May 4.
He said that while Drake served one year as second vice president of the SBC, he is not now nor has ever been a spokesman for the convention.
"Mr. Drake does not represent Southern Baptist actions, resolutions, or positions in his interpretation and application of 'imprecatory prayers,'" Oldham said. "Any comments made by Wiley Drake on this subject represent his personal views, not those of the Convention."
Oldham said most Baptists view the imprecatory prayers found in the Psalms as private, heartfelt conversations between oppressed people and God, and reflect confidence that God will eventually vindicate the innocent. He said they generally close with a conscious decision not to bear malice and leave final judgment up to God.
"I think it is fair to say that the vast majority of Southern Baptists reject any call to pray imprecatory prayers of death over any individual," he said.
-30-
Bob Allen is senior writer for Associated Baptist Press.
