who were the Nazarenes?

[jonathan]

Who Were the Nazarenes?

The first believers in Yahshua where a Jewish sect known as "Nazarenes" or in the Hebrew "N'tzarim" (Acts 11:19; 24:5). Many of the early "Church fathers" wrote about them such as Jerome who lived in the 4th century. He described these Nazarenes as those, "who accept the Messiah in such a way that they do not cease to observe the old Law." (Jerome;On. Is. 8:14). The fourth century "Church Father" Epiphanius gives a more detailed descripturin:

But these sectarians... did not call themselves christians--but "Nazarenes,"... However they are simply complete Jews. They use not only the New Testament but the Old Testament as well, as the Jews do... They have no different ideas, but confess everything exactly as the Law proclaims it and in the Jewish fashion except for their belief in Messiah if you please! for they acknoledge both the resurrection of the dead and the divine creation of all things, and declare that God is one, and that his son is Yahshua the Messiah. They are trained to a nicety in Hebrew. For among them the entire Law, the Prophets, and the Writings are read in Hebrew, as they surely are by the Jews. They are different from the Jews, and different from the Christians, only in the following. They disagree with Jews because they have come to faith in Messiah; but since they are still fettered by the Law, Circumcision, the Sabbath, and the rest they are not in accord with Christians. They are nothing but Jews. They have Goodnews according to Matthew in its entirety in Hebrew. For it is clear that they still preserve this, in the Hebrew alphabet, as it was originally written.

(Epiphanius; Panarion 29)

It is amazing when we come to understand that the early followers of Yahshua kept the Torah as Epiphanius describes. We come to acually understand that the church under its own authority has changed the laws and times. Is that not what Daniel the prophet spoke of what the Beast power would do ? (Daniel 7:25). Understanding this, that when a person beleives in Yahshua Ha Mochiach, he does not convert to a foreign religion. Rather he attaches himself to the set apart people of Yisrael to whom the Coveant was given (Jeremiah 31:31).

Literally hundreds of thousands of Jewish followers were zealous for the Torah (Acts 2:41, 47; 4:4; 6:7; 9:31; 21:20; 15:19-21; 21:17-27).

(This teaching has been taken from www.geocities.com/bigturns33/Torah.html)

[jonathan]

Maybe everybody was wondering why we need to know who the Nazarenes were? Yet if people got to know that this is the faith that we all should be following; i.e. Natzraya Judaism, and not Christianity, then maybe some may take a bigger interest in the topic.............. then, maybe not?!

[kanyon]

Enlighten us please ...

[jonathan]

Thank you Kanyon; I will attempt to.

The true Nataraya are torah abiding jews who have accepted the new covenant with their Messiah, Yashua also a jew. The sect of the Nazarenes as spoken about on two occaissions in Acts were the original group of apostles of which Paul was one.

As the initial article states, this sect nearly became extinct and also as prophesy has indicated, the Sect is to come back into existance, indeed this has now happened circa 1997.

This is the original faith and its beliefs are consistant with those who initially led the 'Way', i.e. the disciples of Yashua themselves. They are torah obedient and thus differ from Christians in this fundamental sense. The Law is not done away with and indeed they state that the new covenant never intended to do away with the Law, as present day Christians teach. Either they are wrong or right in this assumption; it is my opinion that they are definitely right.

Further information can be found at www.assemblyofisrael.com and their beliefs are stated on this new web site.

As Americans and Brits are considered to be exiles from the northern tribes of Israel, who turned their back on the torah circa 700BC; the branch was broken off from its root. As yet this branch has not been re grafted. The only way for the lost tribes of Israel to re gain their inheritance is to repent of their Christian idolotory and re join the root and practice their faith in the same way as the Natzaraya Jew does today.

This is the truth as spoken within the Scriptures and this process of re-grafting must happen before the return of Messiah can take place.

Shalom

[Nikkol]

Although in the "big picture" using the term Nazarene or Christians doesn't change the belief, I found this information:

Nazarene
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
Nazarene may also mean a member of the Church of the Nazarene. The Nazarenes were a group of artists.
Nazarene refers to certain sects of Jewish Christians. The term was applied to early followers of Jesus, and to Jesus himself ("Jesus the Nazarene"), until the spread of Jesus' teachings among Gentiles and the removal of certain Judaic features led to the new term "Christians". The term "Nazarene" remained in use by sects of Jewish Christians, possibly identical with the Ebionites, until around the fourth century. Today, it is used by a number of modern movements within or on the fringes of Christianity and Judaism, often (though not always) to emphasise or claim a Jewish approach to Jesus.

The name "Nazarene" was also taken by a group of early nineteenth century German Romantic painters - see the whole article here


At the same time, the main goal should be to make sure that your belief matches the Word. Whether a person says they are a Christian or a Nazarene, if either "sect" comes in the name of anyone other than Jesus, they are going to hell.

[jonathan]

Thank you for your reply Nikkol.

In fact this topic could so easily descend into a major argument, at least it would do on a British Christian forum, that even though we are in the controversial section, I don't feel it right to go on, of course unless there are those with a bigger inquisitive mind?

In any event, the definitions above are in fact quite good, but the term Natsarim in Hebrew, means watchmen. How were the watchmen of old treated? They came to warn of coming events. Surely it is wise to hear what they have to say.

[ybrown]

jonathan said:

Thank you Kanyon; I will attempt to.

The true Nataraya are torah abiding jews who have accepted the new covenant with their Messiah, Yashua also a jew. The sect of the Nazarenes as spoken about on two occaissions in Acts were the original group of apostles of which Paul was one.

As the initial article states, this sect nearly became extinct and also as prophesy has indicated, the Sect is to come back into existance, indeed this has now happened circa 1997.

This is the original faith and its beliefs are consistant with those who initially led the 'Way', i.e. the disciples of Yashua themselves. They are torah obedient and thus differ from Christians in this fundamental sense. The Law is not done away with and indeed they state that the new covenant never intended to do away with the Law, as present day Christians teach. Either they are wrong or right in this assumption; it is my opinion that they are definitely right.

Further information can be found at www.assemblyofisrael.com and their beliefs are stated on this new web site.

As Americans and Brits are considered to be exiles from the northern tribes of Israel, who turned their back on the torah circa 700BC; the branch was broken off from its root. As yet this branch has not been re grafted. The only way for the lost tribes of Israel to re gain their inheritance is to repent of their Christian idolotory and re join the root and practice their faith in the same way as the Natzaraya Jew does today.

This is the truth as spoken within the Scriptures and this process of re-grafting must happen before the return of Messiah can take place.

Shalom

Jonathon, you say Christians should do as the Nazarene’s and follow the law. I disagree and here are some of my preliminary thoughts on why:

The nation of Israel held the promises of God and the commands of God in trust for the whole world. But God has already promised long ago to bless the whole world through the offspring of Abraham, that is Jesus Christ. But the Jews were blind to this and even the disciples had to be reminded of what Jesus had told them.

John 10:16 I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.

Jesus Christ had other sheep, not of the sheep pen of Israel, that He was going to reach and save. This mystery was shown to Paul and then later it was shown in a vision to Peter.

Acts 10:34-35 Then Peter began to speak: "I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism but accepts men from every nation who fear him and do what is right.

Later Peter had to stand up for the Gentiles so that they would no be required to follow the laws of the Jews, and Paul was there to testify to what God was doing among the Gentiles he had been preaching the Gospel to for some time.

Acts 15:5-12 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses." The apostles and elders met to consider this question. After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: "Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are." The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the miraculous signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them.

In Acts In Acts 2:24 we have a believing Jew (Peter) calling non-believing Jews, brothers, and In 2 Corinthians 1:1 we have a believing Jew (Paul) calling a believing Non-Jew (Timothy) brother. All who lived under the covenant (the first and the renewed) are brothers in the LORD, and brothers as descendants of Abraham.

So why do you think Christians must conform to Jewish law in order to be grafted into the New Covenant when we’re already in it?

What do you consider comprising the old covenant? There are several schools of thought on this.

It’s not that Americans and Brits are considered to be exiles from the northern tribes of Israel, more specifically, it’s those Americans of northern European descent. While the findings of historians, linguists and archeologists are important, they don’t establish with any certainty that Americans of northern European descent, the British, and northern European peoples are indeed the descendants of the Ten Lost Tribes of the House of Israel. The data is inconclusive except for those people willing to accept a very low standard of proof. Except for a limited account of the deportation by the Assyrians and prophecies such as the promises made to the tribes recorded in Genesis 49 the Bible is silent on this subject.

But then I must ask, are you concluding that those descending from Asian and African peoples cannot be grafted into the new covenant because they’re not included in the “lost tribes”?

I'm interested in hearing your thoughts and answers.

[jonathan 1]

ybrown said:

Jonathon, you say Christians should do as the Nazarene’s and follow the law. I disagree and here are some of my preliminary thoughts on why:

The nation of Israel held the promises of God and the commands of God in trust for the whole world. But God has already promised long ago to bless the whole world through the offspring of Abraham, that is Jesus Christ. But the Jews were blind to this and even the disciples had to be reminded of what Jesus had told them.

John 10:16 I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.

Jesus Christ had other sheep, not of the sheep pen of Israel, that He was going to reach and save. This mystery was shown to Paul and then later it was shown in a vision to Peter.

Acts 10:34-35 Then Peter began to speak: "I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism but accepts men from every nation who fear him and do what is right.

Later Peter had to stand up for the Gentiles so that they would no be required to follow the laws of the Jews, and Paul was there to testify to what God was doing among the Gentiles he had been preaching the Gospel to for some time.

Acts 15:5-12 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses." The apostles and elders met to consider this question. After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: "Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are." The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the miraculous signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them.

In Acts In Acts 2:24 we have a believing Jew (Peter) calling non-believing Jews, brothers, and In 2 Corinthians 1:1 we have a believing Jew (Paul) calling a believing Non-Jew (Timothy) brother. All who lived under the covenant (the first and the renewed) are brothers in the LORD, and brothers as descendants of Abraham.

So why do you think Christians must conform to Jewish law in order to be grafted into the New Covenant when we’re already in it?

What do you consider comprising the old covenant? There are several schools of thought on this.

It’s not that Americans and Brits are considered to be exiles from the northern tribes of Israel, more specifically, it’s those Americans of northern European descent. While the findings of historians, linguists and archeologists are important, they don’t establish with any certainty that Americans of northern European descent, the British, and northern European peoples are indeed the descendants of the Ten Lost Tribes of the House of Israel. The data is inconclusive except for those people willing to accept a very low standard of proof. Except for a limited account of the deportation by the Assyrians and prophecies such as the promises made to the tribes recorded in Genesis 49 the Bible is silent on this subject.

But then I must ask, are you concluding that those descending from Asian and African peoples cannot be grafted into the new covenant because they’re not included in the “lost tribes”?

I'm interested in hearing your thoughts and answers.

Peter's speach as you quote indeed talks about the Holy Spirit purifying the hearts of the gentiles but there is one thing which is being overlooked here. Peter was a Nazarene, i.e. he followed the sect of the Nazarenes because he is saying in his speach that although he himself abided by the Torah, just as the Pharisees did, there is something missing, i.e. the Holy Spirit. Just as they had received the Spirit ,ie the Nazarenes so have the gentiles. It is this same Spirit the Jews (Pharisees) needed, but they refused to accept Him.

Christians need to re graft themselves to the branch (root) which is the Torah, in order for them to be complete in their faith and one with Yahweh through Yashua Messiah. The jews need to accept Yashua Messiah inorder to receive the Spirit as their bones are still dry.

The two branches need to join at the root so that EZekial 37 can be fulfilled and the return of Messiah take place.

All people of the World are able to make that cross over and become as Abraham did, a Hebrew. He is the Father of the nations who showed us how. We need to do the will of YHWH as stated in His Word which is the Truth and as is referred to in the Lord's prayer. May His will be done, may we follow his instruction on how to live as set down in the Torah.

[And Such Were Some Of You]

this is interesting and worth looking into (if only for knowledge)!

thanks, johnathon!

[Anointed Teacher]

Ezekiel 37:15-23
15The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,

16Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim and for all the house of Israel his companions:

17And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand.

18And when the children of thy people shall speak unto thee, saying, Wilt thou not shew us what thou meanest by these?

19Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand.

20And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes.

21And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land:

22And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all.

23Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwelling places, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.


This is speaking of the Nation of Israel become one not the Gentiles. We are not under the Law...

This prophesy is dealing with the past ( the Children of Israel in captivity, promising that they will become one nation); present ( they are now one nation, Judah and Israel are one); and future (When the Messiah become King).

AT

[jonathan]

How long will it be until the Northern tribes of Israel who were dispersed by the One Living YHWH Elohim around 700BC to the four corners, realise that the call of the Father is for the two sticks (nations) to be called together as One, both Judah and Ephraim, so that the Messiah can return and establish the One Kingdom here on Earth?