|
|
Post by nina2 on May 19, 2007 6:49:59 GMT -5
"Sometimes God tests a person with poverty and sometimes He tests a person with wealth. Which is a greater test? Wealth is, because a poor person will by nature be humble, and therefore he is less likely to rebel against God." The majority would probably gladly take the test of wealth, rather than the test of poverty.... However, if it is God putting his people to the test, it might go against many teachings. (I do think that it is a controversial topic  ) |
|
|
|
Post by giantsdodie on May 19, 2007 8:02:20 GMT -5
A poor person will by nature be humble  ?? I have to say I disagree with that. Humility has nothing to do with your financial status. I know some poor folks that are just as arrogant and as proud as they can be. |
|
|
|
Post by nina2 on May 20, 2007 13:24:17 GMT -5
OK... I'll try to re-open that door, juuuust a little bit... The premice is that both poverty and wealth are a test from God. So, in the context from which this quote is taken, it addresses believers. It does not say either is a curse, it says a test. So, it is a legitimate question to ask a test of what? There are many accounts in the Bible of people going from poverty to riches, or the opposite. We have the expression about someone being "stricken with poverty". We don't think about the ones with material riches as "stricken with wealth". Yet, it could be, if we consider it under the angle that wealth is actually God's test of our character, but mostly of our heart's attitude towards him. King Solomon says in Proverbs: "Give me neither poverty nor wealth, but allot me my daily bread. Lest I be sated and deny You and say, 'Who is the Lord?'..." (Prov.30:8-9). In Deuteronomy, God warns: "(Deuteronomy 12: ) Lest when you have eaten and are full, and have built goodly houses, and lived there; and when your herds and your flocks multiply, and your silver and your gold is multiplied, and all that you have is multiplied, then your heart be lifted up, and you forget the Lord your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of slavery; who led you through that great and terrible wilderness, where were venomous serpents, and scorpions, and drought, where there was no water; who brought you water out of the rock of flint, who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers knew not, that he might humble you, and that he might test you, to do you good in the end, and you say in your heart, My power and the might of my hand has gotten me this wealth." I agree that humility has nothing to do with our financial status. This writing is speaking about humility before God, regardless of material condition. So, in context, it was not demeaning to people afflicted with poverty. Nor is it saying that it is "easier" to be humble when being poor. Rather, it stresses the fact that we ought to acknowledge our source in everything, regardless of our physical circumstances. It could be that poor people come off as arrogant and proud because they are faced with condescending attitudes, or at least they perceive it as such.... Maybe that's part of the test? A poor person is often "expected" to be humble, modest, in that sense. But, how do you maintain your self esteem in such situation? Poverty does not change anything about who a person is, their gifts, their talents, their uniqueness or their potential. Not in God's sight. On the other hand, even among believers, wealth tends to attract admiration, respect, sometimes envy in disguise... We ought to respect everybody. If wealth is a blessing, God, the source, should be honored first, by both the wealthy and the ones around him. So, the test in both situations is real humility. Depending on our situation, different traits of character might be exposed, might lead to sin. God looks at the heart, and he is interested in our spiritual success first. Wheter poverty or wealth, if there is a test, it is both for the poor or rich ones, and for the ones around them. There has been a lot of teaching about prosperity. And, there was a need for that. However, along the way, some things might have been neglected. Imho, teaching about humility is one of them, me thinks... |
|
|
|
Post by krazeeboi on May 20, 2007 16:24:08 GMT -5
As we all know, a majority of the world's wealth is concentrated to a very small segment of the overall population. I've heard it stated that if you were to take all of the personal wealth in the world and distribute it equally among everyone, in time most of the wealth would still wind up in the hands of that small segment.
Prosperity/wealth is first and foremost a mindset.
|
|
|
|
Post by nina2 on May 21, 2007 2:29:14 GMT -5
And would it be interpolation or extrapolation bringing about this r-evolution-ary cookie cutter thingy? |
|
|
|
Post by giantsdodie on May 21, 2007 11:18:06 GMT -5
I think we need to ask if these things are truly a test of God Because you are poor is in necessily a test from God.. if You are rich is it necessarily a test from God |
|
|
|
Post by nina2 on May 22, 2007 4:54:01 GMT -5
Ecc. 7:10-14
10. Do not say, "How was it that the former days were better than these?" For not out of wisdom have you asked concerning this.
11. Wisdom is good with a heritage, and it is a profit to those who see the sun.
12. For whoever is in the shade of wisdom is in the shade of money, and the advantage of knowledge is that wisdom gives life to its possessor.
13. See God's work, for who can straighten out what he made crooked?
14. On a day of good, be among the good, and on a day of adversity, ponder; God has made one corresponding to the other, to the end that man will find nothing after Him.
Whatever we want to call it, test, trial. etc..
|
|
|
|
Post by giantsdodie on May 22, 2007 7:45:41 GMT -5
The question is however are you necessarily being tested by GOD??
|
|
|
|
Post by nina2 on May 22, 2007 12:40:26 GMT -5
If not of God, then of whom?
Some scriptures specifically say that the test was from God:
Genesis 22: 1-2
1. And it came to pass after these things, that God tested Abraham, and He said to him, "Abraham," and he said, "Here I am."
2. And He said, "Please take your son, your only one, whom you love, yea, Isaac, and go away to the land of Moriah and bring him up there for a burnt offering on one of the mountains, of which I will tell you."
In Deut. 13:4, God says that he is testing his people, and for what the purpose of the test:
Deut. 13:4
4. you shall not heed the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of a dream; for the Lord, your God, is testing you, to know whether you really love the Lord, your God, with all your heart and with all your soul.
5. You shall follow the Lord, your God, fear Him, keep His commandments, heed His voice, worship Him, and cleave to Him.
It is safe to say that we don't want to be tested.... However, for example, we use often Rom. 8:28 and we stop short. The test is for good to those who love him. Then we would have to also consider divine providence and will....
Rom 8:28
And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to [his] purpose.
Rom 8:29
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate [to be] conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Rom 8:30
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
We can also find more about the meaning and purpose of being tested by God by looking at the meaning of the Hebrew word for "to test": the word l'nasos, which means "to test," also means "to raise high."
|
|
|
|
Post by giantsdodie on May 22, 2007 21:08:20 GMT -5
Everything that occurs is life is not necessarily a test of God. I am not questioning whether God tests people. I know for a fact He does...
Is all poverty a test from God.. I would say no....
Its all wealth a test from God.. I would say no...
|
|
|
|
Post by nina2 on May 23, 2007 3:41:16 GMT -5
I would like to say also that we, in general, tend to consider something that we perceive as negative a punishment/judgement, not as a test... There is a difference.
How then can we discern whether it is a test from God or not?
|
|
|
|
Post by giantsdodie on May 24, 2007 8:02:42 GMT -5
I would like to say also that we, in general, tend to consider something that we perceive as negative a punishment/judgement, not as a test... There is a difference. How then can we discern whether it is a test from God or not? Ask Him. |
|
)
?? I have to say I disagree with that. Humility has nothing to do with your financial status. I know some poor folks that are just as arrogant and as proud as they can be.