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Post by Poetricia (G.A.P.) on Sept 22, 2008 5:16:55 GMT -5
Cause Vin some who were sure it was God prior to the discovery may let that discovery cause doubt as to whether or not it was God ("Surely God wouldn'd do this to ME" "God knows I want children" "How can this be God" etc.....)
I know a beautiful young African American Saved and Sanctified young woman, about 39 years old who goes to my church. She lost her husband (to Sicke Cell) 4 years ago this coming January. They were married for only 7 1/2 years and through much prayer and God intervention had one son free of sickle cell who was only 2 1/2 when he died.
As God brought us together as friends, I would listen to her cries of despair in the early stages of grief, not knowing at the time why God put us together as friends, cause I had just started attending this very close knit church. But God used me at a women's retreat to minister to her in a most unique way.
She was saying something like "I just wonder sometimes why did God give me such a good husband, a good provider, father, friend, man of God,etc... if he knew I would only have him for 7 years? I just don't understand." My mouth opened and these words came out.
"God gave you to him cause he knew he would be calling him home in 7 years. It wasn't about you at all, it was about God blessing him with you for the last 7 years of his life. " She says that was the turning point of her grief. Later God had me say something so funny and she told me it was the first time she had laughed since he passed.
Many times we forget that marriage is not about us at all, it's about God's divine plan.
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Post by Beulah5 on Sept 22, 2008 12:03:38 GMT -5
it is not a deal breaker for me at all. if i was in love with him-no probs-we can believe God together  what would be a big deal is if he did not tell me.  |
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Post by vin on Sept 23, 2008 10:12:48 GMT -5
I think that as much as we don't want to admit it or as much as we don't realize it we look for perfection in relationships. We still look for fantasy.
I also know a woman who after going through a divorce moved on and wound up marrying a wonderful man. They were married five years. He retired as a police officer and they began planning trips. If I remember correctly, they had just come back from one trip and were planning to go on a cruise. He went to the bedroom and laid across the bed and died. After only five years of marriage, he was finally retired and all they had to do was enjoy each other and Jesus. And he died.
I understand that we ask the question Why. But to suggest that I would tell God no just because a person has a physical issue is not fair to God. We say it's not fair to us but it's really not to him. I have two words for anybody who would feel like HIV is a deal breaker.....COOKIE JOHNSON.
None of us knows how long a person will live. We don't know our last day. What if you(general) are the one who is ill? Would you (in general) want to be abandoned by someone after they've said God put you together just because you were or became ill?
I know it's just discussion, but these discussions sometimes make me go a little deeper.
I'd rather marry someone God sent me with HIV than to marry someone and then find out after the fact that he's a pedophile.
Don't ask.
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Post by Poetricia (G.A.P.) on Sept 23, 2008 10:44:06 GMT -5
We still look for fantasy. You are so right. And we do that cause we are looking for OUR will and not GOD'S will. You know, there was a time when I actually refused to pray 'nevertheless, not my will, but thy will be done' concerning marriage. But like Abraham, I had to put the thing I most desired from God on the altar and be willing to say, 'Lord I want you more than what I'm asking you for'. It took a few years, but God wouldn't let it go til I surrendered ALL to him!!! But to suggest that I would tell God no ....... is not fair to God. We say it's not fair to us but it's really not to him. I hear my brother in the gospel saying BINGO right about now!!!! What insight, it's not fair to God. I mean, this is his plan, but once again, it's cause we loose sight of the fact that it's NOT ABOUT US so much as it's about HIM. His divine plan, His BIG PICTURE. Where will our marriages fit in the big picture of God's divine plans for the universe. Kinda makes our own will almost a side note, doesn't it? What if you(general) are the one who is ill? Would you (in general) want to be abandoned by someone after they've said God put you together just because you were or became ill? Now, that is the bottom line. Cause we (general) want this knight in shining armor to come fulfill our hearts desires. He's gotta be this, have that, want this, want that, accept us with all our imperferctions, issues, baggage, hang ups, weights and sins, but he best to be a perfect specimen himself!!! We want 'God's best' but are we yet 'God's best'  ?? Okay, I'm done. These are all the lessons and revelations God has opened my eyes to over the years. Perhaps that's why he's had me waiting so long for the man he has for me. So my blinders will be off, my focus will be free of the 'me myself and I' syndrome. |
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Post by kitty on Sept 23, 2008 12:38:00 GMT -5
Wow guys....
have we all gotten to the point that we are so spiritual that we are no good on earth?
I mean seriously... HIV is not cancer.... HIV is not dementia... HIV is not kidney failure... HIV is not a lost job... HIV is not diabetes...
And worst come to worse... HIV is not a drug addiction...
We are looking at laying down one's life. Now if you want to say that you are interested in being married to someone and never having sex then maybe you aren't risking your own life.
But even still the chances of of contracting the virus are still there...
Last time I checked the only time God sent someone to die for someone's sins that was Jesus... Not to mention that I am just about sick on the fact that at this point in time there are so many Black women that are contracting and coming down with HIV/AIDS because they were with partners who had it...
Yes... God is able to do many things... But unless God is calling you to lay hands on this person... Unless God is claiming that He is going to heal this person... Then I think it would be wise for us... especially as women to take a stpe back and then question and wonder truly... Would God tell you to marry a HIV positive man.
Kitty
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Post by kitty on Sept 23, 2008 12:54:47 GMT -5
Oh yeah...
The fantasy... What's wrong with at least hoping you can have sex with your husband? That's not a fantasy... That's a given part of marriage...
I doubt a group of Christian men would debate this... If they didn't want to do it then they wouldn't feel the least bit concerned that it would be God's will... Because they are at least of the mind set that God will send them someone that they want. Not perfect... But at least someone they can have sex with safely. Period.
Oh... And lastly Cookie Johnson... NOT A GOOD EXAMPLE!!!
It is not secret that Cookie Johnson was partly in the marriage for the money...
I mean seriously... Magic left her at the alter 3 count em 3 times....
What woman in her right mind would hold on to a man after that?
Cookie was in a situation that is different that most women because of 2 reasons.....
One she already knew not to be having sex without a condom with Magic because hadn't been faithful to her EVER< EVER<EVER in the relationship! Secondly... it is no secret in medical circles that Magic has access to medical treatments that the average citizen does not... Hence him still being around.
And lastly... I have reliable sources that tell me that Magic even now... still has "girlfreinds" so who knows if Cookie is even having sex with him now... Might be waiting for that joker to fall over and gain her millions.
Kitty
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Post by Poetricia (G.A.P.) on Sept 23, 2008 13:17:52 GMT -5
Let's not get sidetracked.
The whole point of this discussion is if YOU KNEW GOD put you together, ordained that you marry, etc... would you still marry that person if you found out they were HIV+.
For the most part we each have answered that in one way or another.
Nevermind theories of whether or not God would really 'do that'. The scenario was given that God has done just that.
And so my question is HOW MUCH DO WE REALLY TRUST GOD?
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Post by kitty on Sept 23, 2008 13:51:56 GMT -5
I think most of us...
Would have to question it...
Especially when you consider this... Most of us have trouble following God on the small stuff. The stuff we have no doubts that God is saying... We have trouble not lying, have trouble not having sex out side of marriage... we are all having problem with the 10 commandments....
So we would have to question if we could follow God on the big stuff when we are getting by on His forgiveness, mercy and grace on a daily basis for the small stuff.
Kitty
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Post by Poetricia (G.A.P.) on Sept 23, 2008 14:08:40 GMT -5
Again, in the scenario, you KNOW GOD ORDAINED you two to be together.
I wonder how much we really trust God. This is a good discussion. It should cause us to look inward.
What would stop me from following God?
FEAR
fear of not having what I want the way I want it
fear of not knowing what will happen
fear of how hard it would be
Someone asked a great question:
What if their healing depended on my obediance. It think that's a great question. And taking ourselves out of the picture and trusting God's will is a hard thing I know.
p.s.
I'll bet Abraham didn't think God would tell him to sacrifice his own son on the altar either. But he did just that. Cause He wanted to see how much Abraham trusted him.
So I ask, given the scenario, HOW MUCH DO WE REALLY TRUST GOD?
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Post by kitty on Sept 23, 2008 14:29:39 GMT -5
Good question Gap....
I think most of us are still having problems admitting that sometimes we don't trust God... maybe cause we don't always understand.
Kitty
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Post by Poetricia (G.A.P.) on Sept 23, 2008 14:46:08 GMT -5
Yeah I agree, and I actually think it's healthy to admit that because until you put it out there, lay it before God, it can't be dealt with.
I am grateful for the man who said LORD I BELIEVE BUT HELP THOU MY UNBELIEF.
He knew he was lacking trust and asked God to help him.
I think that's basically all God wants us to do. Trust him and ask for help to trust him when we don't can't or won't.
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Post by livinganewlife on Sept 23, 2008 15:12:09 GMT -5
Again, in the scenario, you KNOW GOD ORDAINED you two to be together. If God ordained it do we really have a say so? |
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Post by kitty on Sept 23, 2008 15:39:35 GMT -5
According to the last 2 guys who claimed to have heard from God about me... Yes...
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Post by Jasmine on Sept 23, 2008 17:51:46 GMT -5
According to the last 2 guys who claimed to have heard from God about me... Yes... But if God ordained it, then you don't have a say. Those men "claimed" to have heard from God..but did you hear from God as well? When a man says " your my wife"..a woman's answer shouldn't be " oh really"..it should be " I know", IF they have heard the same from God. |
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Post by vin on Sept 23, 2008 22:32:15 GMT -5
My point about fantasy was not about sex in any way. It was about the fairytale that leads to unrealistic expectations. About thinking that if God brought the two of us together we are somehow going to ride off into the sunset, have the most wonderful marriage, not have many challenges and when we do, overcome them with hardly no effort. We don't voice these fantasies but they come to the surface when we are faced with real life challenges, like in the areas of finances and physical illness.
How many men have gone and gotten another women when he found out his wife had breast cancer only to have the wife survive it? But he wasn't even willing to see it through and be faithful. His little fantasy bubble got busted so he tipped out. How many pastors have been remarried within 3 months after burying their wives? Because they broke the deal long before she died. The fantasy is over and they've gone and gotten another one.
The fantasy I'm talking about is the one that says that real life doesn't happen and a part of real life might be sickness and death, or what we would call untimely death.
The woman I know who lost her husband after only five years, I'm sure she was heartbroken and devastated, but I also be she she wouldn't trade those five years for anything in the world.
There is another couple that comes to mind concerning the HIV question.... Dewayne Woods and his wife. She's still there. I don't know if they were married yet when he found out he was HIV positive but they are still together and he has the testimony now that he has been healed of AIDS. What if she had abandoned him?
None of us knows what could be working in our bodies at this moment. It's the blood of Jesus covering and keeping us as healthy as we are.
I think we should think carefully about how we answer the question because if I say that God sent me someone and I refused them for some reason, then by the same token I'm saying that I would leave them if the thing came up after I married him.
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