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Post by giantsdodie on Nov 14, 2007 17:48:35 GMT -5
Siingles can pay 24-34 percent in taxes depending on your tax bracket. There are excellent resources that teach about Money. Instead of spending money on pure garbage like XL magazine so I can see what the latest rapper is doing and stuff like Jet Magazine we should start buying Money Magazine, Black Enterprise, Smart Money etc etc... and learn how to get out of debt, reduce our expenditures, build businesses etc etc... We really need to stop living for the weekend. I agree....I don't live for the weekend. I don't make very much money either and by the time I'm through paying living expenses, there is nothing left to budget. I own a home and a car. I have a cell phone as my only telephone. I have basic cable and internet service with the cable provider because I am a student and I need the internet at home. It was cheaper to buy the package than the internet service alone. I have cut back as far as I can go. I am not a compulsive shopper. 99% of my income goes to living expenses and tithes and offering and that's the truth. Where I live, I pay mortgage, trash bill, water bill, sewer bill, gas, electric, car insurance, deductions for health, dental, vision, etc. There is no money left to be compulsive with in my case  It makes me angry that I cannot file as head of household because I have no dependents. Yes, I am single, but I am struggling harder to live than someone with a spouse or children. At least they have an extra income or they can get a tax credit for having children. DO the best you can with what you have under the circumstances and if you do the best you can with what you have under the circumstances you will never be under the circumstances. |
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Post by chosen on Nov 14, 2007 17:49:34 GMT -5
I do agree with ya Giant sir. It is a cammandment of the Lord, and it represents a covenant relationship between you and God. Its still so hard, Im praying so hard for God to help me to get my finances in order. I do believe in order to be in total financial freedom you must give your tithes otherwise you finacial situation is just going to get worse for neglecting your tithes. I am a living witness. You just dig youself in a deeper hole. Many Blessings jessica Unfortunately when people talk about tithes and offerings they tend to focus on the negative, which is the part about being cursed. Yet they somehow fail to see the part about where God gives seven covenant blessing because of ONE act of obedience Malachi 3 10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. 11 And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts. 12 And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts. There is no other place in the Bible where I have found GOD to say.. PROVE ME.. TEST ME.. TRY ME...I DARE YOU to do this.. I have had numerous financial struggles but I cannot tell you how many times GOD has come through and brought me out of those very same struggles. I have had jobs come through RIGHT when I needed them. I have had people bless me just out of the blue with finances that I desparately needed. I have had debt cancelled that I had no hopes of paying. I have had people bless me with clothing when I had no money to buy it. God prepared peoples hearts to bless me and my wife when we got married, we didnt pay for a thing out of pocket for our wedding and we both werent working when we got married. I remember once I was in the shower.. and I was crying because I was struggling with finances. I had been out of work for nine months straight and had no income comin in, I was out of savings an it looked like I was going to lose my apartment and have to move back home with my mom and dad.. embarrasing for a 30+ year old man at that time. I was in the shower talking to the Lord about it and crying and praying when my spirit man began to quote the Word of God.. I said Lord.. I know how it looks right now.. but Im a tither and you KNOW Im a giver ( I will give whatever God tells me to give ), I have a covenant with you.. Your word says NEVER have I seen the righteous forsaken or His seed begging bread.. Well GOD I am the righteousness of GOD through Christ JESUS. Now the Word of GOD tells me that man that does not take care of HIS own house is worse than an infidel.. Now God I am not talking about me.. im talking about you.. I am in the Fathers house.. I am of the household of faith... If Im in your house and I KNOW you arent an infidel... so that means you have to take care of me !! I stopped crying and Blessed GOD and finished my shower... Two days later I had a job.... You know why.. FAITH... in GOD. GOD's WORD and GOD's PROMISES.... and guess who that faith comes from.. The Word declares that JESUS is the author and the finisher of our faith.. If I haveANY faith its because HE put it there.... Have faith in GOD.. and YES get a budget.. examine what you have going out and what you have coming in. Find places to make cuts.. I got rid of my cell phone and got a pay as you go phone.. Why pay 50-75 dollars a month,, I have basic cable.. thats it.. I dont need HBO.. SHOWTIME.. etc etc... I also combined my phone and cable together.. that saved me 50 per month which is 750 per year.. thats one rent payment.. I shop at Costco's now for many needs. I havent brought toilet paper since last year lol... Stop eating out.. thats a biggie.. brown bag it to work.... I dont buy brand spanking new anymore.. where is that clearance section?? I dont care if its last years pair of sneakers or jeans... STOP USING CREDIT CARDS !!!!!!! Until you can mamange your finances properly STOP USING THEM... Pay YOURSELF.. save some money.. open an IRA ( you get to write that off your taxes ) save for your future... I sat down with a piece of paper a calculator and the Holy Spirit.. and GOD showed me that even with all my bills and expenses and miscellaneous I should have at least 200-300 dollars left at the end of EVERY month.. I said GOD I dont have that.. He said.. Find what you are doing WRONG... last month I had 230.00 left at the end of the month.. Tithe and offernings accounted for... thats EVERY bill paid.. And I am the only person working in my house.. and I dont make a lot of money... and thats also accounting for money I am putting on the side for Christmas gifts.. With the excess I am paying of one credit card bill in full next week. One less bill.. Its doable.. and sometimes its tough.. sometimes this come that jack your budget... but remember.. HAVE FAITH IN JESUS !!!! Wow Giant sir thank you so much for sharing your testimony that really blessed me tremendously................. The Scripture came to my mind after reading your testimony " The Earth is the Lords and the Fullness thereof and the world and they that dwell therein." also " A cattle on a thousand hills belongs to the Lord" Praise God, Praise God, Praise God. Many Blessings jessica |
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Post by chosen on Nov 14, 2007 22:41:35 GMT -5
Siingles can pay 24-34 percent in taxes depending on your tax bracket. There are excellent resources that teach about Money. Instead of spending money on pure garbage like XL magazine so I can see what the latest rapper is doing and stuff like Jet Magazine we should start buying Money Magazine, Black Enterprise, Smart Money etc etc... and learn how to get out of debt, reduce our expenditures, build businesses etc etc... We really need to stop living for the weekend. I agree....I don't live for the weekend. I don't make very much money either and by the time I'm through paying living expenses, there is nothing left to budget. I own a home and a car. I have a cell phone as my only telephone. I have basic cable and internet service with the cable provider because I am a student and I need the internet at home. It was cheaper to buy the package than the internet service alone. I have cut back as far as I can go. I am not a compulsive shopper. 99% of my income goes to living expenses and tithes and offering and that's the truth. Where I live, I pay mortgage, trash bill, water bill, sewer bill, gas, electric, car insurance, deductions for health, dental, vision, etc. There is no money left to be compulsive with in my case It makes me angry that I cannot file as head of household because I have no dependents. Yes, I am single, but I am struggling harder to live than someone with a spouse or children. At least they have an extra income or they can get a tax credit for having children. Amen Rachel2, you would think a single person would not struggle as much as one who has children or a spouse......... They tax us single's harder, and its true if you do have spouse at least you do have two incomes coming in. Its almost like the Government penalizes you for not having a souse. Love Jessica |
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Post by Rachel2 on Nov 15, 2007 10:58:57 GMT -5
Amen Rachel2, you would think a single person would not struggle as much as one who has children or a spouse......... They tax us single's harder, and its true if you do have spouse at least you do have two incomes coming in. Its almost like the Government penalizes you for not having a souse. Love Jessica It's true, we do pay a higher price for being single. |
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Post by Beulah5 on Nov 15, 2007 11:28:55 GMT -5
I still believe that no matter how many millions God gives us that a simple life is still in order. I am yet to see anyone lead a flashy opulent lifestyle who raises the dead and commands the blind eyes to open.
We do not need to buy 45 homes for ourselves just because God has given us money...many pastors have sacrificed personal time with the lord because they have become consumed by building projects and many believers.
What we have in many places is a fat church which is legendary for its powerlessness. We have raised up rich people who are unprepared for eternity....remember Jesus' warning to ephesus....
Thanks for reading
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Post by giantsdodie on Nov 15, 2007 11:44:22 GMT -5
Who has 45 homes  ? |
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Post by kitty on Nov 15, 2007 12:49:54 GMT -5
Beulah,
Amen to your statement... I don't know if there is any scripture that backs it up... But I honestly tell you guys... That all my life... Even before i was saved. When I would be exposed to many people that had money you could tell an difference in the mind set of those you seemed to operate with excess... and those who were just as equally rich who just as you stated Beulah... seemed to be content with a simpler life style.
Let give you guys a little bit of my background so that you understand the view point from where I am making these statements... Plus I don't Giants to think I'm just being jealous again! LOL ( love you big bro!)
I come from a upper middle class background... as I have stated before... I have never really had to work. My parents took care of me all of my life up til this very day. You guys I have never actually had to work to pay my rent a day in my life.... BUT I have to live within a certain means... There are times when I know that God wasn't pleased with the way I may have indulged myself. And I was by no mean... spending millions.
Secondly... The people that are rich that I have been exposed to... Most have been class mates over the years. I attended a private high school where kids were driving BMW's to school senior year! yeah I was driving too... But I was in a 1976 monte Carlo that my parents had all but abandoned! ( I still love that car!)
And then... the were those... who had the serious Lux sports cars that cost so much money that the average person has never even heard of them! Had never seen one onthe street... Don't bother to aske me the name of the cars know because that was back in 1988... But let me tell you it was really something to see!
You could tell the differnce in the morally of the kids by the way... The were allowed to spend money... and they ways they choose to to use money. The "Paris Hilton" types who were doing drugs, having sex, just way out there in general... Were always the ones who were sporting the most blink!
And those people who were down to earth... You wouldn't know that they had a dime! Let alone millions... For example... One of my friends wa a Indian girl named Geeta. Her whole family were doctors... She was coming fromthe "top caste" in India... She would proudly show me her "K-Mart Special" shoes that she was sooo proud to get a deal on! She was also a good student, good head on her shoulders, moral decency...
I saw this examples of finicial excess being the front runner for other major types of sins long ago... I saw it over and over and over.
So now when I see it in ministry... I am truly worried... That the same thing is occuring.
Kitty
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Post by giantsdodie on Nov 15, 2007 13:21:14 GMT -5
What you are describing is not fiscal excess, what you are describing is moral character. I will not sit here and determine for someone else what excess is. What I will say is that it is imperative to be good stewards. However the level and degree to which GOD will call us to be stewards will vary according to a persons call and character. Lets say I am a minister and I have a house in upstate NY, a house in VA and an apartment in NY is that excess I own several cars. Is that excess The question I am asking is.. who determines what is excess ?? BTW everyone who is rich doesnt run around flaunting it. I wouldnt know what half these minister have or own unless someone reported it. |
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Post by Rachel2 on Nov 15, 2007 13:42:37 GMT -5
DO the best you can with what you have under the circumstances and if you do the best you can with what you have under the circumstances you will never be under the circumstances. This is true...because inspite of my financial challenges, I am filled with peace, joy and hope. Actually, I am down right happy!!  Jesus is my source and He will pick up the slack. |
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Post by Rachel2 on Nov 15, 2007 13:56:52 GMT -5
What you are describing is not fiscal excess, what you are describing is moral character. Exactly.....just because someone has money does not mean they are lacking in character or that they are not operating in the power of the true and living God. Where is it written that you have to be poor and struggling or living a simple lifestyle to have power with God? What I find amazing is that we profess to be children of the King...the God of all things and the minute some of us get blessed with the material things that God says we can have....there is a problem....WHY? My bible says that God has a plan to prosper me. AND I want it. I don't care what anybody says......I don't enjoy struggling financially or otherwise. So, if God wants to bless me with 100 homes, 500 cars, 600 swimming pools and maid and butler service...Hey, I am all for that!!!  |
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Post by Nikkol on Nov 15, 2007 14:11:52 GMT -5
Here's a good scripture to use:
Mark 10:17-31
17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life? 18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God. 19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother. 20 And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth. 21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me. 22 And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions. 23 And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God! 24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God! 25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. 26 And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? 27 And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible. 28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee. 29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's, 30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life. 31 But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.
This of course doesn't mean that if you are "well off" you can't make it in or that you have a lack of character but it can be more difficult. When you think about it, most people pray the most and seek God the most when things are not going well and when things get "better" they go off and do their own thing.
Additionally, there are some people that if they would have a lot of money wouldn't have the relationship with God that they currently have.
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Post by giantsdodie on Nov 15, 2007 15:19:16 GMT -5
The question for me becomes very simple.
Do we serve GOD because He will prosper us?
OR
Does God prosper us because we Serve HIM?
Once again without knowing a persons life and their sacrifice I cannot speak on what they possess. Some of us would have condemned men in the Bible because they had been blessed with an abundance of wealth.
The wealth should always be first and foremost for the sake of the Kingdom but in all honesty I believe there is a poverty mentality that needs to be shaken off.
Does that mean I walk around with all kinds of bling bling on my arm and platinum diamonds on my teefus... no....
But does that mean that I cant drive a Mercedes ?? must I drive a Hyundai ??
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Post by Rachel2 on Nov 15, 2007 15:59:19 GMT -5
Here's a good scripture to use: Mark 10:17-31 17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life? 18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God. 19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother. 20 And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth. 21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me. 22 And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions. 23 And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God! 24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God! 25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. 26 And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? 27 And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible. 28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee. 29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's, 30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life. 31 But many that are first shall be last; and the last first. This of course doesn't mean that if you are "well off" you can't make it in or that you have a lack of character but it can be more difficult. When you think about it, most people pray the most and seek God the most when things are not going well and when things get "better" they go off and do their own thing. Additionally, there are some people that if they would have a lot of money wouldn't have the relationship with God that they currently have. I believe the key words here are "most people" and "some people." Like everything else where Jesus is concerned, it's based on where you are as an individual. Thank God that He deals with us as individuals and not as a group. |
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Post by Beulah5 on Nov 15, 2007 18:05:57 GMT -5
Who has 45 homes ? A very well known evangelist who owns a christian network. I hold firmly to what i said: we still have a sin nature and money can become a real snare to true believers who start well. We are told not to love the world for good reason. There is good reason why God keeps some people on the back of the desert and there is very good reason why many christians would never be millionaires and why God will never give us 50 swimming pools and 500 homes no matter what the prosperity evangelist promises us. Also note that i did not say having money i said leading an opulent lifestyle. I believe that there is a place in the presence of God that a person who loves opulence or ie the things of this world will never taste. Not all but many people who think of money, talk about money and are consumed by money never find the deep things of God. Listening to some of the proponents of that is nothing more than listening to a secular motivational speaker-that is what a lot of so called christianity has been reduced to. Back to my statement why are believers in villages raising the dead while sanctuaries full of saints with gilded chandeliers are barely causing any waves in their communities? I like to look at things practically not just what sounds good. Again u are talking to someone who does not believe that money is essential for the propagation of the gospel. 12 ordinary folks took it to the world without jets, without tv, without tracts. One shepherd on the back of the desert led about 6 million people to the promised land with no material wealth..... Today we have more than any church age materially and yet we are not a effective Sorry i just like to be real and if anyone wants to take this to the next level i am game however there is a documentary on a man who is half tree half man and i also have a sirloin steak waiting  Cy'all morrow |
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Post by Beulah5 on Nov 15, 2007 18:23:45 GMT -5
I also truly believe that if one is truly following God that He will bless u in the manner which seems fit to Him.
I by no way have a poverty mentality however i dont believe that prosperity is signified by things necessarily.
I am sorry but i am one who is hungry for nations and ethnic groups. I would rather live in a shack and have millions of unbelievers fall to their knees under the conviction of the lord when i enter a room than live in a mansion while my neighbourhood goes to hell.
Any millions that we are privileged to be handed by the lord is for the transformation of nations not to waer £10,000 suits to prove we have arrived somewhere.
We are told to store up treasures in heaven not earth and if someone is truly walking with God anyway u will be blessed on every side so perhaps we as believers need to focus on getting the presence into our lives instead-i have had gold dust fall on me in my living room one night in prayer and i know of places where gold nuggets, emeralds and sapphires have fallen from heaven after a heavy visitation of the presence of God.
We must be chasing the wrong thing-that is obviously why we aint seeing nuffink (said in a JB voice) ROFL!!!
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