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Post by Nikkol on Sept 8, 2005 8:01:31 GMT -5
It doesn't mean that it has to be over 40,000 years old but that is the "assumption" that they are stating as fact. Remember, it's only science. And science is FULL of them making theories equal to facts.
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Post by beck on Sept 8, 2005 8:10:13 GMT -5
I think everyone believes in the Pre-Adamic Era, But Man's theory gives belief to an Pre-Adamic Race. I watched a documentary about how Scientist traced the creation of man back to one person who originated in Africa. Something about the Y chromosomes in a male that collects “junk” tracing mans history. They also said that some big event happened that could have possibly killed of a lot of animals they were mentioning a super volcano some place in Africa. I thought that was interesting because a lot of pre-Adamic believers say that fiery event was when Satan was cast down from heaven from Genesis 1:1 to Genesis 1:2.
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Post by MsKayLander on Sept 8, 2005 10:29:12 GMT -5
found this info to share...
The gap theory is logically inconsistent because it explains away what it is supposed to accommodate -- supposed evidence for an old earth.
Gap theorists accept that the earth is very old. They base this on geologic evidence interpreted with the assumption that the present is the key to the past. This assumption implies that in the past, sediments containing fossils formed at basically the same rate as they do today. This is also used by most geologists and biologists to justify belief in the "geologic column" as represented by billions of years of earth history. This geologic column has become the showcase of evolution because the fossils are claimed to show "ascent" from simple to complex forms.
This places gap theorists in a dilemma. Committed to literal creation because of their acceptance of a "literal" view of Genesis, they cannot accept the conclusions of evolution based on the geologic column. Nor can they accept that the days in the Genesis record correspond to geologic periods. So they propose that God reshaped the earth and re-created all life in six literal days after "Lucifer's flood" (which produced fossils); hence the name "ruin-reconstruction." Satan's sin supposedly caused this flood and the resulting judgment upon that sin reduced the previous world to a state of being "without form and void."
While the gap theorist may think Lucifer's flood solves the problem, this actually removes the reason for the theory in the first place. If all, or most, of the sediments and fossils were produced quickly in one massive worldwide Lucifer's flood, then the main "evidence" that the earth is extremely old (based on the assumed slow formation of the sediments) no longer exists.
Also, if the world was reduced to a shapeless chaotic mess, as gap theorists propose, how could a reasonably ordered assemblage of fossils and sediments remain as evidence? Surely with such chaos the fossil record would have been severely disrupted, if not entirely destroyed. (This argument also applies to those who say the fossil record formed over hundreds of millions of years before this so-called "Lucifer's flood," which would have severely rearranged things.)
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Post by Jasmine on Sept 8, 2005 15:06:25 GMT -5
I think everyone believes in the Pre-Adamic Era, But Man's theory gives belief to an Pre-Adamic Race. I watched a documentary about how Scientist traced the creation of man back to one person who originated in Africa. Something about the Y chromosomes in a male that collects “junk” tracing mans history. They also said that some big event happened that could have possibly killed of a lot of animals they were mentioning a super volcano some place in Africa. I thought that was interesting because a lot of pre-Adamic believers say that fiery event was when Satan was cast down from heaven from Genesis 1:1 to Genesis 1:2. I don't believe in it. |
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Post by Beck on Sept 8, 2005 15:13:32 GMT -5
I think everyone believes in the Pre-Adamic Era, But Man's theory gives belief to an Pre-Adamic Race. I watched a documentary about how Scientist traced the creation of man back to one person who originated in Africa. Something about the Y chromosomes in a male that collects “junk” tracing mans history. They also said that some big event happened that could have possibly killed of a lot of animals they were mentioning a super volcano some place in Africa. I thought that was interesting because a lot of pre-Adamic believers say that fiery event was when Satan was cast down from heaven from Genesis 1:1 to Genesis 1:2. I don't believe in it. You dont believe that satan was cast down before adam was created? |
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Post by this2shallpass on Sept 8, 2005 19:45:37 GMT -5
Jasmine said: I don't believe that.I knew soon enough someone was going to say they didn't believe that, Elderbeck I was waiting on that response before posting anything further. If everbody believed in the Pre-Adamic Era, this topic would be over, for me. I've only heard pastor's allude to events after lucifer was cast out of heaven. Most saints are, and rightfully so, concerned with the message of Salvation, and Him Crucified. I like to read, and the Word is one of my favoriate Books. I'm a researcher at heart, so to study this topic was born (several years ago) out of an interest to know, not to persuade others to believe what I have discovered through my private research. AT, I haven't forgot your question. The short answer is: yes. I want to post the response in the correct context, so I'm taking time to make sure my wording is posted correctly.  BTW: I don't support any of man's theory of evolution. No way.
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Post by krazeeboi on Sept 8, 2005 20:57:12 GMT -5
From an article entitled The Gap Theory of Genesis Chapter One: Additional support for the gap theory is recruited, or perhaps conscripted is better, from the phrase “without form and void.” An appeal is made to consider other Biblical texts in which these words are found together and it is pointed out that these passages, Isaiah 24:1 and Jeremiah 4:23 are judgmental in character and context. This claim is true only if one limits the context to the verses, for when considered in their complete context the support begins to vanish. In both of the cited passages the judgment which is spoken of is future and is not a statement of a past action of God. The subjects of the judgments are Israel and Edom and not the entire earth. Not only is it a future judgment limited to a specific peoples, but the judgment spoken of is itself limited, not a comprehensive world wide judgment as required by the gap theory. Both Isaiah and Jeremiah, in the context of the subject judgments, show that there will be survivors on the earth (or land) that is to be “without form and void.” This would certainly not be true for the postulated condition following the world-wide catastrophe as claimed.
These two verses are not the only ones containing these words in the Old Testament. They are used in a number of places and translated with a variety of words. Without giving an exhaustive analysis of these verses, it suffices to say that they are all suitably translated by rendering the Hebrew “tohu” and “bohu” (without form, void) as “empty” and “lifeless.” Usually the implication is a place not suitable for habitation such as a desert. This condition could be the result of a judgmental action, but again as before, the context must show that to be the case. A context of divine judgment is difficult, if not impossible, to exegete from Genesis chapter one. It is clear from the text that the necessary and desirable features of an earth suitable for man’s habitation were absent in Genesis 1:2, however, this does not justify the interpretation that “without form and void” means ruined, chaotic or judged.
An additional appeal is made by the gap theorists to Isaiah 45:18 where it is stated that the earth was not created in “vain” (tohu). They claim that since this is so in Isaiah, the “tohu” of Genesis 1:2 precludes the condition of Genesis 1:1 as being contiguous. When one considers the remainder of Isaiah 45:18 the context becomes clear. The verse continues by stating that “He (God) formed (asah) it (the earth) to be inhabited.” The word in opposition to vain is inhabited, thus allowing the rendering of “tohu” as uninhabited. The verse does not then speak of a condition, but of an intention or purpose. It was not God’s purpose to create the earth to be uninhabited and the remainder of the Genesis narrative tells how God achieved His desired end, a complete creation dwelt in by those created in His own image. The concept of empty or lifeless is still suitable. Thus the phrase “without form and void” is not an indication of a chaotic state, but the earth is well ordered and awaiting further commands from God. |
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Post by this2shallpass on Sept 8, 2005 22:10:35 GMT -5
Now K, I thought you was gone stay home, since you ordered everybody outta you house |
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Post by Anointed Teacher on Sept 9, 2005 15:40:56 GMT -5
KB, I knew you was going to stirred up something, but I almost fell asleep trying to read it. Sorry, this one not going to work. The Holy Spirit has taught me, not man and I believe this2shallpass was also taught by the Holy Spirit. If you can find something bigger than the Holy Spirit, we might buy it. AT |
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Post by krazeeboi on Sept 9, 2005 20:10:10 GMT -5
So you have the audacity to believe that only you and those who agree with you are/can be lead by the Holy Spirit?
Spare me.
Use solid hermeneutical principles and stop using fanciful, overmystical, esoteric interpretations as an excuse for bad theology.
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Post by Anointed Teacher on Sept 10, 2005 11:17:59 GMT -5
So you have the audacity to believe that only you and those who agree with you are/can be lead by the Holy Spirit? Spare me. Use solid hermeneutical principles and stop using fanciful, overmystical, esoteric interpretations as an excuse for bad theology. Krazee, did I say, only those who agree with me is led by the Holy Spirit?..... NO! You get beside yourself, cool down Brother and realize you don't know everything. WE (this mean everybody, not just you) can get so caught up in esoteric theological studies, that we leave no room for the Holy Spirit to reveal revelation knowledge. Isn't HE, The Holy Spirit is our teacher, who will lead us to all turth? That don't mean we shouldn't have the ministry of teacher, but we should alway seek what He have to reveal to us. He is our helper, why not slow down and allow Him to help and stop with those dry articals, from dry commentaries, that was not written under the power of the Holy Spirit. What is esoteric or limited interpretation and bad theology..... anything you don't agree with or understand? AT |
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Post by Jasmine on Sept 11, 2005 0:43:04 GMT -5
You dont believe that satan was cast down before adam was created? I dont believe in the Pre-adamite man or even race. I believe just as the scripture says: 1 Corinthian 15: 45-49
45And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. The first man was Adam. |
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Post by beck on Sept 11, 2005 5:52:36 GMT -5
You dont believe that satan was cast down before adam was created? I dont believe in the Pre-adamite man or even race. I believe just as the scripture says: 1 Corinthian 15: 45-49
45And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. The first man was Adam. thats what I was talking about..I wasnt talking about the pre adamic race... |
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Post by krazeeboi on Sept 11, 2005 16:35:57 GMT -5
So you have the audacity to believe that only you and those who agree with you are/can be lead by the Holy Spirit? Spare me. Use solid hermeneutical principles and stop using fanciful, overmystical, esoteric interpretations as an excuse for bad theology. Krazee, did I say, only those who agree with me is led by the Holy Spirit?..... NO! In this one instance, it was HEAVILY implied. You basically said it without saying it. Personally, I found it to be very haughty of you to even consider such a thing. But, for some reason, I'm not surprised. This is true, but I'm not seeing how you have demonstrated that this is true of me or anyone else who holds a view similar to mine. What you said in your previous post basically says that if one doesn't adhere to a belief in a "pre-Adamic race," then that person isn't receiving "revelation" (and the correct term is actually illumination, by the way) from the Holy Spirit And...  See, there you go again....all you are saying is that those articles and commentaries are "dry" simply because they don't agree with what you claim the Holy Spirit "revealed" to you. Stop mincing words and just come out and say it, because it is exactly what you mean. No; what I consider bad theology is any theology that: 1) gives more attention to the adversary than what is explicitly outlined in scripture 2) undermines the atonement by implying that some people have lived that were not qualified for God's grace through the death of Christ because they were not of the lineage of Adam 3) panders to godless streams of scientific thought by making unwarranted extrapolations of the biblical text to accomodate the theories purported by such streams of thought The "pre-Adamic" race theory does all three. |
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Post by jasmine nsi on Sept 11, 2005 20:00:21 GMT -5
I dont believe in the Pre-adamite man or even race. I believe just as the scripture says: 1 Corinthian 15: 45-49
45And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. The first man was Adam. thats what I was talking about..I wasnt talking about the pre adamic race... My bad elder maybe i was reading your post wrong |
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