women preachers

[lanl ns]

This is not a topic on whether or not women should preach; we''we've beaten that to death ;D.

This is more of a Protocol question:

Pastor of a church invites another church to come and worship with his congregation.

Prior to worship service, the Pastor opens the invitation for all licensed ministers to join the pulpit. Women in "pants" start getting up to take their seat on the pulpit.

Members of the "home" church start looking crazy at the women and the Pastor's wife ask that all women come down out of the pulpit because "our" denomination does not honor women preachers and women are not allowed to seat in the pulpit, especially with pants on.

The ushers start escorting the women out of the pulpit one by one.

The women from the visiting church become angry, because they feel that their titles and positions should be honored.......................

mmmm, do you all think this was right?

[ATT]

The pastor of that congregation should have never gave an open invitation to ALL LICENSED MINISTERS, if he had an issues with women preacher and women wearing pant. These women were his guest and he invited them to his church and on his pulpit when he gave the invitation, they should have been treated with respect, regardless of their denominational belief. The congregation should have been asked to respect all guests. The pastor's wife was WRONG, for openly disrespecting these women ministers and was wrong for embarrassing them in front of the congregation, and their members that was visiting. Those women ministers should be offended and probably hurt.

Where is the LOVE and respect this church suppose to have toward God's people. I know they would never step foot back in that church. I know the men ministers who believe and support women ministers were offended too, and probably cut that church off their list of fellowship.

ATT

[lanl ns]

ATT, as a minister is it your responsibility to understand the rules and doctrines of another church body?

[And Such Were Some Of You]

IMO, it was wrong, out of order and very RELIGIOUS (however, those were the rules of that church). Also, if the Pastor gave the permission, why did his wife come after him and reverse it? One word: CONFUSION.

[MsKayLander]

andsuchweresomeofu said:

IMO, it was wrong, out of order and very RELIGIOUS (however, those were the rules of that church). Also, if the Pastor gave the permission, why did his wife come after him and reverse it? One word: CONFUSION.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMMMMMENN!!!!

[ATT]

lanl said:

ATT, as a minister is it your responsibility to understand the rules and doctrines of another church body?

This Pastor invited these people to his church to fellowship with him and his congregation. They may not know the rules and thought it was OK since he (the leader of the church) gave an open invitation for ALL ministers to come to the pulpit. He knew their were people in his congregation from different denomination and background and I'm pretty sure he knew there were some women minister there. Even if it was a mistake, because they were his guest, he should had let them stay there and plan to never give another open invitation like that again. Later explain to his members that he could not openly embarrass these women after he have invited them up.

This type of attitude causes division in the Body of Church. When visiting a church, you don't know the rules of that house. It is up to the church to provide visitors with the House Rules, and not open rebuke and embarrass them.

When we come together as a Body of Christ from different churches and denominational backgrounds, we should put our denominational difference aside and fellowship and walk in Love. If you can't, than only fellowship with those who believe like you do.

ATT

[lanl ns]

I was sitting next to the 1st Lady when this occurred and was shocked that the Pastor's wife asked that the women preachers come down out of the pulpit.

That was so embarrassing and IMHO so distasteful and do you all know that Pastor preached his heart out and that visiting church raised $10,000 for that Pastor's Anniversary.

I was wondering are there proper etiquette procedures one should use when visiting churches outside your denomination?

[Jasmine]

LOL!! wow that was crazy.

Just as ATT said he should have allowed them to stay in the pulpit, in realizing that the other denominations allow women to carry the title as "minister", and not just "missionary or evangelist".

[Nikkol]

Usually, those types of things are already known prior to visiting another church (or at least should be). There are times when I visit other churches and although I may be a licensced minister, some ministries don't see women as such and therefore I wouldn't go up in the pulput (although personally I prefer never to sit up there).

Although one poster said that the invitation shouldn't have been given, it is possible that the pastor believed that the visiting pastor had the same standards and therefore didn't expect to see women coming up.... but of course if the visiting pastor knew the standards, that would've never been an issue. I know that one poster mentioned that they should've been allowed to stay. However, if the standard of the ministry is the opposite, it would be cause much confusion in the church. Consistency is definitely necessary.

I think that the visiting pastor should've known the standards of the ministry. Just like if we know that eating meat offends our brother, we shouldn't do it. This is not to say that eating meat or not eating meat is wrong; just different. Although some may see that pants in the pulpit are ok or that women ministers are ok, for others, it could be a stumbling block. I usually say that it is best when fellowshipping with new ministries to take the "very conservative" role. I know of one church in particular that when they go to fellowship at particular churches, the pastor tells the congregation to bring their head coverings because that is the standard of that ministry.

On our confirmation letters, we let the visiting church know any standards that we have ahead of time, this way there would be no confusion and out of respect those that minister at GFDM abide by the standards of the ministry.

I don't think that they should've been angry. For honoring or not honoring a title/position won't change who you are. Was it religious? Maybe. But being religious although is given such a negative connotation doesn't have to be as such.

Lesson: Make sure you know the standards of any church you visit and if one can't find out, be very conservative as not to offend. ( Of course this is specifically for those who are saved )

[ATT]

Ministers, over all.... pastor, prophet/ess, Apostle, Evangelist, Teacher, Deacon/ess, Bishop, Elder, Missionary, Musician, Psalmist etc. He did not asked for specific Title.... He said Licensed Minister, so if women can be a Missionary, Muscian and Psalmist in that denomination.... They were included. The Leader should've known you don't just let anybody on your pulpit male and female.... He should have asked them to stand and openly welcome them.

Most people think those churches have grown out of that mind set, especially the pants issue and fellowship with other believers, without being so religious and judgmental.

I think what was so offensive, was that the first lady openly embarass and rebuke the women ministers in front of the congregation. Why couldn't she just pass a note to them asking them to sit with her in the front seats. They may have felt honor to sit with the first lady and would have taken it personal.

ATT

[And Such Were Some Of You]

amen...att. it was confusion, they could have allowed them to stay there and explained it to the congregation as a lesson learned!

[Beulah]

Sheer nonsense

[And Such Were Some Of You]

Beulah said:

Sheer nonsense

LOL ;D

[stillfocused1]

No, a visiting Pastor should not know the "standards" of the church he has been invited to speak at. It is the responsibility of the Pastor hosting that event to accept and embrace all who walk through the doors of the church he Pastors; along with his congregation. I am quite sure as these women honored the request of the Pastor and his wife without saying a word they discerned what the most urgent need of this congregation was without saying a word or reacting in a negative way. This reminds me of what God told Samuel when he was going to anoint Eliab as the next King...I Samuel 16:7 But, the Lord said to Samuel " Do not consider his appearance or height, for I have rejected him. " The Lord does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but, the Lord looks at the heart." Somebody may have missed the blessing, turnaround, miracle they were waiting for or worse yet, salvation because a handful of people hardened their hearts to receive others who were dressed differently than the way they were accustomized to and acted in a matter that was not pleasing to God. And just maybe the Lord told those women to wear those pants that day to test the hearts of that people to see if they were ready receive the harvest..that stands ready to walk through their doors. Everybody coming through the doors of our Churches have not been " churched" therefore standards, doctrines, how to dress, what to wear and not wear will not be important to them..the only thing of importance to them will be the truth that will be revealed to them through the intimacy they will experience through relationship with Jesus Christ..and while we sit offended because somebody wore pants, had on red lipstick, and the list could go on..those will be very people he uses to flip this country upside down because nothing will matter to them except what he requires of them. I glad that Pastor did not walk; yet, chose to exemplify the love of Christ by speaking and assisting this fellowship with raising $10,000; that is so awesome !! I say it again ..the standard set any denomination are not necessarily the standards of God..yet, just the mere rules and dictates of set by man.

[auneeqsol]

Wow!!!

I have seen what you all have written and for the most I can agree, but overall I Believe that things should be done decently and in order. Now for the most part, I dont wear pants that often when I am ministering at another church, just for the simple fact that the norm is to wear a skirt or a dress, in other words women are seen ministering in dresses or skirts moreso than pants. But that's my personal conviction.

But for him to say that "all" licensed ministers come forth, he wasnt thinking, thats why it says be slow to speak.... think first at what you are saying. Actually that was the green light for "all" to come up. Men or women. And too bad they didnt recognize women clergy, they ought not have invited them to their church. And for the most it was VERY RUDE of the pastor's wife to do what she did. She was totally out of order, because if it wasnt done out of love then, it was wrong anyway. Ask this question: WWJD??? I dont think that would have gone okay with him, as a matter of fact he has preached on that kind of stuff many times. Respector of persons, looking on the outward appearance. He said the traditions of your forefathers have killed you.
Church Folks!!! Im not bashing anyone, but Church Folks gonna be Church Folks. That's a universal truth.