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Post by anointed on Apr 18, 2008 11:16:43 GMT -5
Well, with the millions Tyler make I think he would go on and say, "Feel free to be a critic... It ain't hurting my pocket!" ;D
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Post by Jasmine on Apr 18, 2008 11:20:01 GMT -5
Why is there such a misconception that ALL black folks think alike?
If I disagree with something or some art form based on my own personal preferences than I am criticizing, downing a brother or sister....
When in all honesty, I am just expressing my personal beliefs and opinions based upon my personal experiences and viewpoint.
I have never understood why is it that ALL blacks are expected to agree or like something or someone just because it is BLACK! I understand what you are saying sis, which is why I say that we need to be careful about using the "broad brush." Also, just because one is giving their view on something, doesn't necessarily mean that it is a negative thing or we are "hating" on someone. I never understood that mentality and I may never understand it. constructive criticism is totally different from "Hating". I asked if anyone viewed the video posted, for the sake of key components as to why..black people "hate and criticize" on each other. There is a huge difference in constructive criticism, and criticizing to criticize. There is also a difference between disagreeing, and criticizing. |
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Post by And Such Were Some Of You on Apr 18, 2008 12:17:37 GMT -5
I understand what you are saying sis, which is why I say that we need to be careful about using the "broad brush." Also, just because one is giving their view on something, doesn't necessarily mean that it is a negative thing or we are "hating" on someone. I never understood that mentality and I may never understand it. constructive criticism is totally different from "Hating". I asked if anyone viewed the video posted, for the sake of key components as to why..black people "hate and criticize" on each other. There is a huge difference in constructive criticism, and criticizing to criticize. There is also a difference between disagreeing, and criticizing. Indeed! I knew exactly what you were suggesting. |
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Post by anointedteacher on Apr 18, 2008 15:30:00 GMT -5
I understand what you are saying sis, which is why I say that we need to be careful about using the "broad brush." Also, just because one is giving their view on something, doesn't necessarily mean that it is a negative thing or we are "hating" on someone. I never understood that mentality and I may never understand it. constructive criticism is totally different from "Hating". I asked if anyone viewed the video posted, for the sake of key components as to why..black people "hate and criticize" on each other. There is a huge difference in constructive criticism, and criticizing to criticize. There is also a difference between disagreeing, and criticizing. Can you explain the different... Because I havn't really witness much constructive criticism.. but whole lot of critcizing to criticize. And can you or anybody tell me the different between hating, seculating, slanders, and opinion... definition, and example can help us to understand. I don't think anybody hating Tyler Perry, but don't understand what exactly what he trying to show us in his plays and movies... He sending out a message that we as black woman don't always see on the movie screen... |
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Post by stillfocused on Apr 18, 2008 16:10:44 GMT -5
HE remains that I am loved and capable of being loved no matter what my circumstances maybe.
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Post by Jasmine on Apr 18, 2008 20:05:41 GMT -5
constructive criticism is totally different from "Hating". I asked if anyone viewed the video posted, for the sake of key components as to why..black people "hate and criticize" on each other. There is a huge difference in constructive criticism, and criticizing to criticize. There is also a difference between disagreeing, and criticizing. Can you explain the different... Because I haven't really witness much constructive criticism.. but whole lot of criticizing to criticize. And can you or anybody tell me the different between hating, seculating, slanders, and opinion... definition, and example can help us to understand. I don't think anybody hating Tyler Perry, but don't understand what exactly what he trying to show us in his plays and movies... He sending out a message that we as black woman don't always see on the movie screen... Yes I can explain the difference. Constructive criticism generally comes from those who have a compassionate attitude toward the individual they are critiquing. They have your best interest at heart. A person who is in the same line of work, as you, and has succeeded on a level that you may have not reached yet. They offer their expertise knowledge and help shape you into providing a better material (or whatever the gift, goods, product) may be. Criticism: Is an evaluation both good and bad, based on prior knowledge. Destructive criticism: is intended to harm someone, derogate and destroy someone’s creation, prestige, reputation and self-esteem on whatever level it might be. This may be done intentionally or out of sheer ignorance and foolishness. Which is why its destructive. Often destructive criticism comes from persons who are envious, cruel and those who judges in fields which are not their own. In Psychology criticism can also be a tool of antisocial behavior, such as a passive-aggressive attack Also USEFUL criticism is often a practical part of Constructive Criticism. |
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Post by anointedteacher on Apr 18, 2008 22:12:19 GMT -5
Can you explain the different... Because I haven't really witness much constructive criticism.. but whole lot of criticizing to criticize. And can you or anybody tell me the different between hating, seculating, slanders, and opinion... definition, and example can help us to understand. I don't think anybody hating Tyler Perry, but don't understand what exactly what he trying to show us in his plays and movies... He sending out a message that we as black woman don't always see on the movie screen...
Constructive criticism generally comes from those who have a compassionate attitude toward the individual they are critiquing. They have your best interest at heart. A person who is in the same line of work, as you, and has succeeded on a level that you may have not reached yet. They offer their expertise knowledge and help shape you into providing a better material (or whatever the gift, goods, product) may be.
Criticism: Is an evaluation both good and bad, based on prior knowledge.
Destructive criticism: is intended to harm someone, derogate and destroy someone’s creation, prestige, reputation and self-esteem on whatever level it might be. This may be done intentionally or out of sheer ignorance and foolishness. Which is why its destructive. Often destructive criticism comes from persons who are envious, cruel and those who judges in fields which are not their own.
In Psychology criticism can also be a tool of antisocial behavior, such as a passive-aggressive attack
Also USEFUL criticism is often a practical part of Constructive Criticism.
[/size] With the above definition... what would be the proper way to use of constructive criticism toward Tyler Perry... If we don't have any or very little knowledge of the movie industries. |
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Post by Jasmine on Apr 19, 2008 2:08:28 GMT -5
Yes I can explain the difference.
Constructive criticism generally comes from those who have a compassionate attitude toward the individual they are critiquing. They have your best interest at heart. A person who is in the same line of work, as you, and has succeeded on a level that you may have not reached yet. They offer their expertise knowledge and help shape you into providing a better material (or whatever the gift, goods, product) may be.
Criticism: Is an evaluation both good and bad, based on prior knowledge.
Destructive criticism: is intended to harm someone, derogate and destroy someone’s creation, prestige, reputation and self-esteem on whatever level it might be. This may be done intentionally or out of sheer ignorance and foolishness. Which is why its destructive. Often destructive criticism comes from persons who are envious, cruel and those who judges in fields which are not their own.
In Psychology criticism can also be a tool of antisocial behavior, such as a passive-aggressive attack
Also USEFUL criticism is often a practical part of Constructive Criticism.
[/size] With the above definition... what would be the proper way to use of constructive criticism toward Tyler Perry... If we don't have any or very little knowledge of the movie industries.[/quote] There can not be any constructive criticism due to the fact that tyler perrry is not in the midst of the conversation. Constructive criticism takes place when the Critic and the Criticized are involved in the "criticism" discussion. |
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Post by Jasmine on Apr 19, 2008 2:20:53 GMT -5
Also to answer your other questions.
Hating: Is to dis. To hate on a person really means to ENVY them for what they have..or have achieved.
Seculating: I have no clue what seculating is.
Slander: is a false statement made that harms a persons reputation, name, character in the community. This also includes Libel (which is usually done in publishing, and over media),
Its basically defamation of character, and is all apart of the tort law (meaning its a civil wrong) and you can be sued.
Opinion is a personal assessment, judgements or thoughts towards something. It is NOT a fact, as it has not been proven or verified. Once it becomes verified or proven, it then becomes a FACT.
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Post by keita on Apr 21, 2008 8:19:17 GMT -5
I "BUMPED" this thread because of a statement that keita made on another thread:
I thought the statement was an interesting one and I thought we could look into it a bit further as I feel she has a valid point. , Thanks so much for noticing that comment, finding it valid and bringing it out of a JB/TW thread. I'm both still, and so impressed by the literally countless "glean-worthy" comments, posts, exchanges, and topics scattered all throughout and buried among the assorted JB/TW threads. I actually found reading through those discussions "in review" to be quite worthwhile. It brought an entirely different perspective from "being there" . When I made the comment you quoted, sis anointed and I were actually having a discussion which was just one example of the very kind and quality that I saw happen so often throughout the JB/TW threads. Despite[/i] our strong differences and whatever persistent distractions. At that time, we were talking about the reading/discussion of Thomas Weeks' latest book, and here's the portion of our conversation (edited for relevance) that connects it to this thread and also puts my comment in context. : As I read through the posts which followed sis ASWSOY's repeating my statement on this thread, I thought it was important to also give the context for my comment . Because, it seemed that perhaps my perspective about some of Tyler Perry's most popular and familiar work might have been somewhat misunderstood. So, and just in case, let me make it real plain. I love Black folks from the depths of my soul. My wholehearted support and celebration of Black arts and culture is an intrinsic part of how I was raised and who I am. I deeply appreciate the genius and value of Black cinema, in all of its many and varied flavors, and marvel at our use of it to tell our myriad stories. I also greatly respect Tyler Perry's gift and talent for relevant and relatable storytelling. I am absolutely thrilled for his commercial success, and am both pleased and proud to see him use it to create employment opportunities for Black actors from the unknown to the well known. I have enjoyed a few of his plays, most of his movies and am even counted among those who actually and regularly watch his current tv show. And in all honesty, I laugh just as long, loud, and hard as anyone at a whole lot of what Tyler Perry says and does as "Madea". BUT... when I do, I'm never quite or completely comfortable and have often been convicted. And I believe that's precisely because I know that ANY man dressing as a woman, or vice versa, is engaging in a behavior that is clearly prohibited in scripture. That would make it a sin for ANY man or woman to do so....including Tyler Perry. And, at least at this point, I'm not at all sure that whether cross-dressing is done in secret, onstage, in a movie, or "out" on a Friday night... how entertaining, rich, successful, famous, etc. the person cross-dressing may be... how many others are also, who else might be, and whatever the reason for cross-dressing ... whatever race he/she is ... the person being my very best friend or among my closest family... he/she being loved by GOD and me as well... makes it any less a sin. Oh, and as sis anointed and I were talking, I also said ...I've found that Christians as "actors" and performers can actually make for a very interesting discussion too. As a woman who loves GOD, knows the enemy, and works with words a lot, I've learned to both appreciate and respect their power, "in the natural" and especially "in the spirit". I've discovered that their roots, origin, meaning and usage are always relevant and I'm definitely not a big fan of the (usually faulty and often deceptive) "just semantics" argument. So on that point, for starters, the fact that the English words "hypocrite" and "hypocrisy" have their origin in the Greek word for "actor/acting on the stage, pretense" is certainly interesting to me, to say the least, and especially in light of the translated scriptures. |
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Post by vindicated on Apr 21, 2008 10:29:40 GMT -5
movie producers will have critcs. authors will have critics. anyone in the entertainment industry will have critics. Get used to it! I don't see anyone here dogging him and again, we are painting with a broad brush and should really be careful. Sis Vin. I am assuming that you are a black female. I am a black female. You asked us to critique your writings. Now if I happen to give some constructive criticism would that be that I am hating on you or that I am your worse enemy? I am trying to get the understanding of what it is that you are trying to communicate. Do you know that sometimes what the 'critics" say actually help us to grow or cause our "work" to grow? That's what I'm saying. But not all I'm saying. I didn't ask for critique. I asked for FEEDBACK. I don't need the critique because I know my story and I know how to tell it. The feedback let's me know I'm on the right track even when it's negative. I know some people will say, "what happened next?!" Some people will say, "I think you should have talked to your husband". When I know I did, many times. Some people will say don't compare what you have to what someone else has. I know that too. Other's will say "I think you was stupid". I know I WILL and SHOULD get all of those reactions. That's what feedback is. I'm an anointed writer. A good writer. So unless someone catches a type-o, there's not a lot of proofreading they can do. My comments may be a little "loaded" too and and that may be unfair to you guys here. I went to his message board and saw some of the other comments that people make. Just stupid stuff. And you can see that some of the people are upset with him about how much money he's making. That's what they have a problem with. "Tyler what are you doing with all that money you making offa us!" When he was sleeping in his car where were we? He can't please everybody and I'm glad HE knows that. Fooling with Black folks he'd be sleeping in his car again. |
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Post by keita on Apr 21, 2008 11:27:45 GMT -5
My comments may be a little "loaded" too and and that may be unfair to you guys here. I went to his message board and saw some of the other comments that people make. Just stupid stuff. And you can see that some of the people are upset with him about how much money he's making. That's what they have a problem with. "Tyler what are you doing with all that money you making offa us!" When he was sleeping in his car where were we? He can't please everybody and I'm glad HE knows that. , I think your comments are right on point, especially regarding that self-destructive "crabs in a barrel" mentality that we, as Black folks can often, and yet, be so foolishly guilty of. We are definitely and, imho, pathologically prone to let the "haterade" just spew out, even all over the shiny success of one of our own. LOL! I know exactly what you're saying and it's so unfortunately true. But at the same time, whether in response to constructive criticism, wise spiritual counsel, or his own heart and mind, I'm just glad Tyler Perry has made and announced the decision to move away from playing the character of "Madea". Because I just think, and as he's so clearly demonstrated, Tyler Perry's gifts and talents are so very much bigger and better than that. Even more importantly, I'm glad about his decision because I believe cross-dressing is disobeying God's word. And continuing to do that is "fooling with" GOD, which could turn "sleeping in his car" into an aspiration. |
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Post by vindicated on Apr 21, 2008 11:28:20 GMT -5
My main problem with the criticizing as far as Black go is that we do it to EACH OTHER. But if a white person was doing the same thing or worse we'd have no comment.
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Post by And Such Were Some Of You on Apr 21, 2008 11:36:07 GMT -5
My main problem with the criticizing as far as Black go is that we do it to EACH OTHER. But if a white person was doing the same thing or worse we'd have no comment. In my case this is not true. I cannot speak for everyone else. |
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Post by Jasmine on Apr 21, 2008 11:38:22 GMT -5
I also agree that I am glad that he has moven away from the "Madea" role. I enjoy his movies, and I do say and (quite often) that I like him playing himself (as a man) in the movies he make. Not only is he is a great play writer, film producer and etc..He is a great actor.  |
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