|
|
Post by Jasmine nsi on Oct 20, 2005 15:40:02 GMT -5
I read the entire speech and excerpted that which spoke volumnes to me... I don't agree with what he believes, but we can not deny there is a thread of truth in what he is saying.... Sometimes the church, mosque and synagogue pay more attention to money than sufficing the needs of the people, so the people wonder if they are only present to give money. Leaders and ministers look like pimps. Jesus said, “Whoever would be your minister”—not let him be your pimp—but “let him be your servant.” If you make money the goal, rather than saving people, then you will lose both people and money. Jesus said, “I am going to make you a fisher of men.”
Are ministers happy because your houses are full? Are you satisfied that you have fished enough or have you stopped fishing because all the ministers needs are met, so we do not care about the people who are swimming in the sea of filth and sin? Question: if a person speaks truth and doesn't believe that JESUS is the son of GOD... do we totally discount everything they say?  Of course not. I believe the truth is truth. regardless of what a persons believes.. |
|
|
|
Post by Nikkol on Oct 20, 2005 16:37:12 GMT -5
I have noticed a change in Min Farrakhan's speeches.... One thing I found interesting in this speech is the quote below: “God is a spirit and those who worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth, for such the Father seeketh.” Jesus never taught people to worship him. Yet, you sit around praising Jesus and doing wrong; talking about Jesus and continuing your wicked ways. We need to research that, now that I am thinking about it I never recalled Jesus asking us to give Him praise and Worship. And the majority of our time spent in church worship and testifying is giving praise / worship to Jesus and not God....... We cry all day long moaning Thank you Jesus and never say thank you God............... Is there any relevance to what the Minister has stated............. We do see that Jesus was worshiped. One instance is with the man in the mountains..... And Jesus is God manifested in flesh...... If Jesus isn't God, than there is a worship of two "Gods"........ So is there relevance? Not really. Just allows one to see how many people don't know who Jesus truly is.... |
|
|
|
Post by And Such Were Some Of You on Oct 20, 2005 16:38:59 GMT -5
nikkol,
nobody said that Jesus isn't God.
|
|
|
|
Post by ybrown on Oct 20, 2005 20:51:11 GMT -5
nikkol, nobody said that Jesus isn't God. My concern about Farrakhan quoting Jesus, and saved folks finding wisdom in his statements when he does is that he isn't talking about the same Jesus that we're talking about. Jesus to him is a prophet, not Savior and God in the flesh. Nikkol can speak for herself, but I think the point she was making is that just because someone knows of Jesus doesn't mean that they know Jesus. I have a two-part question for anyone that wants to answer. "In Jesus' Name" means by the authority and power of Jesus, in His cause, for the extension of God's Kingdom or in accordance with His holy will and purpose. It's safe to say that anything that was prayed or said prior to those words aligned with and were said to uphold that authority. Correct? With that said, here is my first question: If we use that same logic of when we pray in Jesus' name, can we safely assume that when Farrakhan begins his speech with: "In the name of Allah, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful," that whatever he says thereafter is said to uphold and propogate the idea of Allah and his kingdom? Secondly, is there really any good in Farrakhan quoting Jesus when it's only done to uphold his concept of Jesus as a mere historical figure, all the while upholding Allah as the God over all? There's one thing we must keep in perspective and that's Farrakhan only says the name of Jesus, he doesn't profess the name of Jesus. The danger is that saying the name of Jesus in conjunction with a prayer for Allah ultimately deceives people into believing that Jesus came because he was sent by Allah, and not by the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. This also propagates the false idea that Christians and Muslims serve the same god. The way Farrakhan quotes Jesus, some sister or brother could easily think that by joining up with the Nation of Islam that they're accepting Jesus. Any thoughts? |
|
|
|
Post by Jasmine on Oct 20, 2005 23:18:42 GMT -5
Absolutely none!..Its kind of like that secular artist who receives an award for its number one Rap Explicit lyrics cd, and Gives the Glory to God.  |
|
|
|
Post by J13578 on Oct 21, 2005 5:03:39 GMT -5
"This also propagates the false idea that Christians and Muslims serve the same god.
The way Farrakhan quotes Jesus, some sister or brother could easily think that by joining up with the Nation of Islam that they're accepting Jesus."
Just a thought, in light of what you said:
Could it be also because of the level on which brothers and sisters bond?
We cannot deny that some nations have kept their identity, as a whole, in the natural as well as in the spiritual. Even though not all of them, individually, have followed or kept practicing their religion, in the natural they still share a strong bond. They identify with each other, naturally, and have that sense of brotherhood and sisterhood, of belonging.
The strong current in Mr Farrakhan's message - just my opinion - is that is he is extremely appealing because of that, he identifies with the the people (nation) he is adressing, and they do with him, naturally.
It is a powerful factor, and there is a possibility that, because of that, the spiritual lines might be blurred, or, at least, not have the priority in how we hear and listen to what he says....
However, is that enough for a Christian to embrace Islam? I don't believe that. I think that it is possible to agree with what Mr Farrakhan says, in all objectivity, because it is true, yet to show discernment and not cross that line and accept him as our spiritual leader.
|
|
|
|
Post by Anointed Teacher on Oct 21, 2005 7:04:10 GMT -5
"This also propagates the false idea that Christians and Muslims serve the same god. The way Farrakhan quotes Jesus, some sister or brother could easily think that by joining up with the Nation of Islam that they're accepting Jesus." Just a thought, in light of what you said: Could it be also because of the level on which brothers and sisters bond? We cannot deny that some nations have kept their identity, as a whole, in the natural as well as in the spiritual. Even though not all of them, individually, have followed or kept practicing their religion, in the natural they still share a strong bond. They identify with each other, naturally, and have that sense of brotherhood and sisterhood, of belonging. The strong current in Mr Farrakhan's message - just my opinion - is that is he is extremely appealing because of that, he identifies with the the people (nation) he is adressing, and they do with him, naturally. It is a powerful factor, and there is a possibility that, because of that, the spiritual lines might be blurred, or, at least, not have the priority in how we hear and listen to what he says.... However, is that enough for a Christian to embrace Islam? I don't believe that. I think that it is possible to agree with what Mr Farrakhan says, in all objectivity, because it is true, yet to show discernment and not cross that line and accept him as our spiritual leader. What Farrakhan said is not true..... The average Christian is living saved.... The average pastor is doing what they call to do.... Yes, there some living in sin and some pastors are out for self gain and mis-directing the sheep, but it is not as many as you think.... God alway reserve a people for himself. Elijah had the same mind-set, thinking he was the only one, God revealed to him, that He have 7000 prophets. If you living saved, there are at least 7000 more just like you. Farrakhan operates in the spirit of the anti-christ, his job is to separates and bring diivision from Christ. We suppose to do both, worship and pick up our cross and follow him. I would not listen to an anti-christ speech, I would not even acknowledge him.... I'm not saying we shouldn't participant in event such as self help, investments, etc. that is informational, Non Christian religious function is a no no. We must guard out heart and aviod anything that is against Christ. It may sound and appear to be truth, but it is not, it is deception..... We all know that even the elected can be deceived. I don't even listen to every preacher come my way more less a known false prophet. I don't want that spirit, don't need to hear what he have to say.... My knowledge, wisdom and understanding comes from God.... God is not going to use a false prophet to teach His people, He will use a donkey first. Brother and sisterhood? In the muslim belief, if they decide convert to a Christian, they suppose to be executed, you know.... beheaded. They love one minute than hate you the next. God Bless AT |
|
|
|
Post by And Such Were Some Of You on Oct 21, 2005 7:14:54 GMT -5
Amen, Anointed Teacher, Amen.
|
|
|
|
Post by Nikkol on Oct 21, 2005 7:32:18 GMT -5
I do believe that we shouldn't become tied/yoked to someone who is not naming the name of Christ. That should be a given. Also, those who are Christians indeed are living a life dedicated to Christ. If their life isn't showing Christ, they aren't Christians. At the same time, I believe that a person can tell the truth and this isn't contingent on them being saved. Honestly, he (Farrakhan) is a very good orator and his messages do hold some truth. One message in particular was We must reflect Jesus the revolutionary. This is actually something that can be read online.
|
|
|
|
Post by GiantsDODie ns on Oct 21, 2005 7:47:16 GMT -5
"This also propagates the false idea that Christians and Muslims serve the same god. The way Farrakhan quotes Jesus, some sister or brother could easily think that by joining up with the Nation of Islam that they're accepting Jesus." Just a thought, in light of what you said: Could it be also because of the level on which brothers and sisters bond? We cannot deny that some nations have kept their identity, as a whole, in the natural as well as in the spiritual. Even though not all of them, individually, have followed or kept practicing their religion, in the natural they still share a strong bond. They identify with each other, naturally, and have that sense of brotherhood and sisterhood, of belonging. The strong current in Mr Farrakhan's message - just my opinion - is that is he is extremely appealing because of that, he identifies with the the people (nation) he is adressing, and they do with him, naturally. It is a powerful factor, and there is a possibility that, because of that, the spiritual lines might be blurred, or, at least, not have the priority in how we hear and listen to what he says.... However, is that enough for a Christian to embrace Islam? I don't believe that. I think that it is possible to agree with what Mr Farrakhan says, in all objectivity, because it is true, yet to show discernment and not cross that line and accept him as our spiritual leader. What Farrakhan said is not true..... The average Christian is living saved.... The average pastor is doing what they call to do.... Yes, there some living in sin and some pastors are out for self gain and mis-directing the sheep, but it is not as many as you think.... God alway reserve a people for himself. Elijah had the same mind-set, thinking he was the only one, God revealed to him, that He have 7000 prophets. If you living saved, there are at least 7000 more just like you. Farrakhan operates in the spirit of the anti-christ, his job is to separates and bring diivision from Christ. We suppose to do both, worship and pick up our cross and follow him. I would not listen to an anti-christ speech, I would not even acknowledge him.... I'm not saying we shouldn't participant in event such as self help, investments, etc. that is informational, Non Christian religious function is a no no. We must guard out heart and aviod anything that is against Christ. It may sound and appear to be truth, but it is not, it is deception..... We all know that even the elected can be deceived. I don't even listen to every preacher come my way more less a known false prophet. I don't want that spirit, don't need to hear what he have to say.... My knowledge, wisdom and understanding comes from God.... God is not going to use a false prophet to teach His people, He will use a donkey first. Brother and sisterhood? In the muslim belief, if they decide convert to a Christian, they suppose to be executed, you know.... beheaded. They love one minute than hate you the next. God Bless AT I know I am gonna get blasted for this but thats never stopped me before. One of the problems with African American Christians is that we need to stop worshipping our " blackness ". Embracing your culture is fine but not when it will cause one to compromise our most important citizenship which is in the Kingdom of God which embraces ALL culture and all culture must be submitted to it. Its this level of compromise while worshipping our "blackness" that has African American pastors, leaders and bishops standing alongside the spirit of Anti Christ while he teaches error, calls himself the messiah, and tries to sell an " atonement " without Jesus. One last thing.. The elect CANNOT be deceived. The Bible says IF it were possible even the very elect would be decieved. That statement means its not possible, |
|
|
|
Post by And Such Were Some Of You on Oct 21, 2005 8:02:33 GMT -5
Amen GiantsDoDie!!! Many will get blasted for speaking truth!
|
|
|
|
Post by MsKayLander on Oct 21, 2005 8:37:29 GMT -5
The reality is really this.... we can call Farrakhan anti-christ or whatever we want to... but the reality is this... he loves people in whatever condition they are in and that draws people regardless of their condition... WE, as "Christians" can't draw anything because we don't walk in LOVE and UNITY.... we walk in denomination and who's wrong and who's right.... we are judgemental... love folks to life... wherever they are.... we don't with our Holy Ghost filled, fire-baptized selves... we ain't loving folks to life.....  |
|
|
|
Post by lanl ns on Oct 21, 2005 8:43:40 GMT -5
"This also propagates the false idea that Christians and Muslims serve the same god. The way Farrakhan quotes Jesus, some sister or brother could easily think that by joining up with the Nation of Islam that they're accepting Jesus." However, is that enough for a Christian to embrace Islam? I don't believe that. I think that it is possible to agree with what Mr Farrakhan says, in all objectivity, because it is true, yet to show discernment and not cross that line and accept him as our spiritual leader. There is no way ANY person who can hear, see, breathe, deaf, blind or any other handicap can accept Islam especially the Nation of Islam and believe that they are accepting Jesus as their Lord and Savior. It is impossible because that is not their belief. Islam teaches that Jesus was just a "mere" prophet called of God (Allah) like Mohamed...... But one thing FOR SURE that differentiate Mohamed and Jesus that is if you check out Mohamed grave his bones were still there. But if one will check out the grave that Jesus was in, he was no longer there. He was RESURRECTED and defeated death the last enemy that shall be destroyed for the saving of our souls, thank you Lord. |
|
|
|
Post by And Such Were Some Of You on Oct 21, 2005 8:47:57 GMT -5
Again, Amen to the last 2 posters.
Though I do not follow Farrakhan or believe in anything he says due to the fact that he does not accept Jesus as his Lord and Saviour. Though the overall "appearance" of his speach may seem true the very fact that he doesn't recognize Jesus for who He really is, is what makes him "anti-Christ".
Again, anything done without love as the motivation is just noise.
|
|
|
|
Post by lanl ns on Oct 21, 2005 8:50:57 GMT -5
[ What Farrakhan said is not true..... The average Christian is living saved.... AT AT that statement hold so much truth because the average person is only living SAVE through the grace of Jesus. The bible says "By grace we are saved through faith and not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not by works should any man boast " |
|
